Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by barrkel on Monday October 17, 2016 @09:41AM (#12724861)

Poe's law strikes again.

Nobody owes you a living. "Contributing to the labour force" isn't a religion; it is a necessary condition of life, without which we starve. There's no free lunch.

I think that, to protect your ego against accusations of laziness, you've projected this idea of society as a pointless activity, so you can defend to yourself your choices. It is self-delusional.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by pjc50 on Monday October 17, 2016 @10:10AM (#12725133)

"Contributing to the labour force" isn't a religion; it is a necessary condition of life, without which we starve.

.. and that's why we turn pensioners out into the snow once they cease contributing.

Oh, wait, no we don't, because we recognise that they're human beings and members of society.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by jazzyk on Monday October 17, 2016 @11:13AM (#12725678)

Pensioners contributed through all their life to society and when they retire, it is expected that they are taken care of.

The OP is talking about cases where you are not in retirement, and not disabled, the society expects you to pull your own weight. It is only fair, no?

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by pjc50 on Monday October 17, 2016 @03:33PM (#12728649)

I'm no longer sure which post is "OP" in this thread, but the problem is definitely deciding which people are and are not disabled. Setting up an adversarial system where you have to prove disability makes the problem worse, not better: people who are only somewhat disabled lose out, while people who are better at faking it get the benefits.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by adamredwoods on Monday October 17, 2016 @12:57PM (#12726803)

What about those without pensions? Homemakers, minimum wage earners? Is it fair to ask them to pull their own weight past retirement age?

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by jazzyk on Monday October 17, 2016 @01:21PM (#12727052)

1. Homemakers typically share and then 'inherit' their spouse's pension (if the spouse dies).

2. Even minimum wage earners have retirement contributions deducted through payroll. Not a lot of money, true, but poor people's pensions are slightly subsidized by higher earners (which is fair, IMO).

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by zer0gravity on Monday October 17, 2016 @10:22AM (#12725236)

A quote from Jack Sparrow ( and I don't think it's a coincidence that it comes form a pirate, but that doesn't make it imoral, as long as it stands the test of reality ) :

"There is no good or bad, it's only what you can or you cannot do".

Everyone will act in it's best interest, according to the possibilites that is has available.

Those possibilites are refined by the feedback from the other members of society.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by wu-ikkyu on Monday October 17, 2016 @10:25AM (#12725270)

>Nobody owes you a living. "Contributing to the labour force" isn't a religion; it is a necessary condition of life, without which we starve. There's no free lunch...It is self-delusional

100 years ago this may have been true, but there has been this great thing called automation (letting machines do our work for us) which has flourished over the past century (especially in the area of food production).

Food production is a solved problem. ~40% of food goes wasted in the US every year.

So no, we don't need "all hands on deck" to keep us from starving anymore. Insisting on such in the face of obvious surplus and an obesity epidemic is what is delusional.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by kakarot on Monday October 17, 2016 @10:02AM (#12725064)

Fa real, it's like people think if society didn't exist everything would be better and we wouldn't be scrounging for basic necessities on a daily basis, without much time for lofty pursuits.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by c0nducktr on Monday October 17, 2016 @11:11AM (#12725665)

Nobody is calling for getting rid of society.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by jokoon on Monday October 17, 2016 @10:55AM (#12725502)

> Nobody owes you a living.

Since FDR, social programs has been implemented, so actually, yes, everyone is owed something because we understood that society can easily crash if some people don't have food.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by witty_username on Monday October 17, 2016 @11:20AM (#12725768)

Do most people think that way? I thought social programs were more about moral aspects (it's unethical to let someone die of starvation simply because they don't have enough money).

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Millions of Men Are Missing from the Job Market by jokoon on Monday October 17, 2016 @11:37AM (#12725973)

> Do most people think that way?

Well you should knock to doors in all the ghettos you can find to get an answer or at least some bit of conversation.

> I thought social programs were more about moral aspects

It's also a matter of society not drowning in crime. It's better if government can give money to people instead of criminal paying poor people to sell drugs.

[ Parent | on HN ]