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Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by natrius on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @11:58AM (#12255478)
Facebook's profitability is not your problem. It's their job to figure out how to get paid. It's your job to protect your mind.

Targeted ads are worse than gambling. We made sure everyone's aware of the dangers of gambling, but everyone's in the dark about targeted ads. These companies know what they're doing. If people want to portray ad blocking as stealing, so be it. Steal from them. They deserve it.

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by hsod on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @12:24PM (#12255707)
> Facebook's profitability is not your problem.

No, but acting with honesty and fairness is. Facebook is asking you not to use their service if you are going to block ads. I think it's obvious that the "right" thing to do is to respect their wishes, not sneeringly defy them while using their resources and giving nothing in return.

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by ubernostrum on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @01:18PM (#12256144)
Facebook is a social-media advertising company. Their model, boiled down, is to extract the maximum possible value out of me in return for the minimum possible effort from them.

Why shouldn't I approach them the same way? And given how often the above describes the way businesses will treat me, why shouldn't I generalize that position?

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by hsod on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @02:33PM (#12256780)
> Why shouldn't I approach them the same way?

Practically: because it leads to a race to the bottom, lowering to their level, the world just gets worse and worse

Philosophically: because ethics are a fundamental part of who you are, and strangers acting unethically does not relieve you of their burdens

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by ubernostrum on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @02:46PM (#12256876)
OK, so how far would you like to take that?

Facebook will try to track me and my behavior, and tailor ads based on it, regardless of whether I'm a Facebook user and regardless of whether I'm logged in. In theory any link someone sends me might end up trying to connect to Facebook's advertising network and record information about my behavior.

At what point do I "agree" to this? What do I get "in return" for this? What if it's a crappy article that I close right away? Or the page load takes too long and I close it before it finishes (but, in true form, the ad code would already have run)? Since I don't know until I've loaded the page -- at which point you think I have an ethical duty to let Facebook serve ads -- whether it will have ads at all, or whether they'll be Facebook ads, at what point do I find that out and have an opportunity, in your model, to decide I don't want to be a party to that?

(in case you're wondering, the correct answer is "use an ad-blocker to pre-emptively ensure nobody can force ads on you without your agreement")

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by hsod on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @03:33PM (#12257172)
This is an overly specific distraction. Accidentally or unwillingly loading FB resources doesn't come with any ethical obligations, obviously.

I'm talking about being a Facebook user, as in maintaining a profile and logging on and using the site. My contention is that by affirmatively choosing to use their resources, an ethical obligation is created.

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by ubernostrum on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @03:52PM (#12257292)
I don't think I have any ethical obligation to Facebook whatsoever. My browser is my agent, not theirs. I can and do already modify lots of sites to hide cruft (like "social recommendations") I don't want to see; do you think I have an ethical obligation to consume a site exactly as its creator intended it to look? Do I only have an ethical obligation if the creator stands to somehow make money from it? What if what I'm blocking isn't an ad but is a referral link where they'd get paid if I go there and buy something?

There is no coherent position which creates an ethical obligation to view sites in full and unmodified (especially given that one of the primary purposes of web browsers, historically, has been to mangle what a site sent to you into something that's actually a sensible and renderable document tree).

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by beefield on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @04:39PM (#12257552)
I do agree when these strangers are living and breathing human beings. But when the stranger is an institution whose sole purpose of being and the only ethics defined by the owners of the institution (and even law?) is to extract as much net value from me as possible, I have difficulties understanding why I should still play with the rule book for good guys. If this makes me a bad person, so be it. Can't say I am too ashamed of that...
Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by facetube on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @01:10PM (#12256081)
There is absolutely nothing dishonest about only downloading and rendering the web content you want to view.
Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by hsod on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @02:34PM (#12256793)
IMO, the technical mechanisms are irrelevant. the ethical questions easily map to a face-to-face interaction.
Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by Falkon1313 on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @10:29PM (#12259126)
Yes. In a face-to-face interaction, if the other party is sneezing and coughing and spraying mucus on your face, it is not unethical to wear a surgical mask. There is no moral or ethical requirement to inhale someone else's possibly virus-laden mucus just because you want to have a conversation.
Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by Nursie on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @04:23PM (#12257439)
I don't believe they do map that easily - in a face to face interaction I'm not enabling your advertising with my bandwidth and my rendering device.
Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by Kalium on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @03:24PM (#12257117)
Facebook, in a spirit of honesty and fairness, asks me nicely to look at ads when they send me HTML. I, also in a spirit of honesty and fairness, have the option of deciding what of that HTML I want to look at.

There is nothing honest or fair about dictating what happens on someone else's computer without user input. That's what malware does. Are you pro-malware?

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by _RPM on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @01:09PM (#12256078)
> Giving them nothing in return.

You're giving them a lot, even if you don't click on ads or see ads. Is it not clear that your data is valuable? You're giving them personal information. Not that people that aren't developers care.

Re:Facebook will force advertising on ad-blocking users by joosters on Tuesday August 09, 2016 @02:12PM (#12256608)
Facebook is asking you not to use their service if you are going to block ads.

No they aren't (at least, not yet). Where do you think it says this in their terms & conditions?