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Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by whatthesmack on Monday May 09, 2016 @02:15PM (#11661894)
> "flat earthers", blatant racists, and charlatans air time (excuse the hyperbole, hopefully the point was understood).

The point was understood, but differently than you intended.

These terms seem to be used to reference the folks that would claim to hold the conservative viewpoint, but the terms themselves only further evidence the misunderstood viewpoint non-conservatives may have of conservatives, and that misunderstanding may have been furthered by what is discussed in the article.

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by throwit992 on Monday May 09, 2016 @02:42PM (#11662083)
To piggyback on this, one of the things Jonathan Haidt has shown in his work on ideological bias is that liberals are unable to accurately understand the conservative worldview, while both conservative and moderates are able to accurately explain liberal positions.

Here's an explanation of the study:

>One other point that I find really interesting and important about Haidt’s work is his findings on the ability of different groups to empathize across these ideological divides. So in his book (p. 287) Haidt reports on the following experiment: after determining whether someone is liberal or conservative, he then has each person answer the standard battery of questions as if he were the opposite ideology. So, he would ask a liberal to answer the questions as if he were a “typical conservative” and vice-versa. What he finds is quite striking: “The results were clear and consistent. Moderates and conservatives were most accurate in their predictions, whether they were pretending to be liberals or conservatives. Liberals were the least accurate, especially those who describe themselves as ‘very liberal.’ The biggest errors in the whole study came when liberals answered the Care and Fairness questions while pretending to be conservatives.” In other words, moderates and conservatives can understand the liberal worldview and liberals are unable to relate to the conservative worldview, especially when it comes to questions of care and fairness.

From: http://volokh.com/2014/01/17/jonathan-haidt-psychology-polit...

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by protomyth on Monday May 09, 2016 @02:47PM (#11662119)
Part of that might be that conservatives and moderates hear the liberal opinion expressed in so many out outlets that it is fairly easy to give an accurate answer where liberals hear what liberal outlets think conservatives think which is sensationalized to gain eyeballs.

I was taught to be able to argue the other sides opinion as well because then you truly understand what you believe.

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by pyoung on Monday May 09, 2016 @03:53PM (#11662616)
Or it could be due to the fact that the current conservative movement relies on deception to push it's agenda, which makes it difficult for the average lay person to even understand what they stand for. Tax cuts marketed as economic stimulus, attacks on regulations and consumer/environmental protections marketed as 'making government more efficient', racial oppression disguised as drug/crime laws, universal health care spun as death panels, etc...
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by ambulancechaser on Monday May 09, 2016 @04:58PM (#11663151)
It is pretty funny that in a thread about liberals not being able to accurately summarize conservative ideas you would ascribe to maliciousness a different opinion. You are behaving in the way that the study pointed out but you seem to be defending that position due to "deception" on the part of conservatives.
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by MustardTiger on Monday May 09, 2016 @04:24PM (#11662838)
>Or it could be due to the fact that the current conservative movement relies on deception to push it's agenda, which makes it difficult for the average lay person to even understand what they stand for.

Then why do only liberals have a problem understanding it? Why are moderates and conservatives able to understand without difficulty? Are they not "lay person"s?

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by protomyth on Monday May 09, 2016 @04:27PM (#11662860)
Its nice to see throwit992 point proven in such close proximity to the comment. Your spin doesn't reflect the beliefs of any conservative I have met. We aren't twirling mustaches here.
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by pyoung on Monday May 09, 2016 @05:33PM (#11663391)
Except for the fact that I would describe myself as a moderate. I can empathize with the desire and need for sensible tax cuts and smaller government, but I can't support a platform that is incoherent and hypocritical.

EDIT: To add a little more substance. I think the incoherence stems from the fact that the current conservative alliance is formed from approximately 3 distinct groups, with different priorities. You have the religious folks who care about abortion, same-sex marriage, drug laws, etc... And then you have the blue collar group that cares more about immigration, guns, etc.. And then you have the pro-business group which mostly cares about taxes and deregulation. From the outside looking in, it shouldn't be surprising that it's hard to empathize with the 'conservative' world view, because the external manifestations of that worldview are often very contradictory (i.e. why would a group that supports small-government also support the drug war, etc...)

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by Inconel on Monday May 09, 2016 @07:18PM (#11664040)
I would describe myself as liberal, even by the already relatively liberal standards of coastal California, but I'm not sure incoherence and hypocrisy are things only the Republican party is guilty of.

I see many of the same aspects of incoherence among Democrats and you don't exactly have to look for it in the hidden trenches of the Democratic party. I certainly don't think Sen. Feinstein's views on encryption are in line with those of an open progressive society.

I see the same hypocrisy in Democrats' views on gun control, and specifically the prohibition against convicted felons exercising their constitutional right to bear arms.

I'm generally of the opinion that the criminal justice system in the US is fundamentally broken and institutionally racist/discriminatory. Going by that premise, and seeing the specific hurdles that poor people, and specifically poor black men, face in terms of selective enforcement, likelihood of being offered pretrial plea bargains, chances of conviction, and length of sentencing, I find it hard to view any laws that hope to strip citizens of their rights based on a tainted justice system as anything other than racist. And yet, these laws are broadly supported by both Democrats and Republicans.

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by dragonwriter on Monday May 09, 2016 @07:24PM (#11664078)
> I would describe myself as liberal, even by the already relatively liberal standards of coastal California, but I'm not sure incoherence and hypocrisy are things only the Republican party is guilty of.

An electoral system that can naturally support only two substantially competitive parties guarantees that parties that cannot maintain incoherence will also not be major parties. While the electoral system empirically does reduce the significant axes of variation of political vies in the population [1], it doesn't reduce it so far as to actually fit on the one-dimensional axis implied by a two-party system. So the major parties must be incoherent to be competitive.

[1] See, Arendt Lijphart's Patterns of Democracy for research on this.

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by protomyth on Monday May 09, 2016 @05:53PM (#11663515)
It isn't "incoherent and hypocritical" but gets portrayed that way. Some of that is messaging as the GOP is not very media savvy, but by and large, its people who have no desire to understand before reporting.

[edit after the edit - please don't edit after someone has already replied - it makes the replier look bad]

From the outside, Democrats can be viewed as a bunch of special interests under one tent. I find much of these "group slicing" to be problematic when talking about the GOP as I don't think its really those groups or the ultimate belief is what is reported. Viewing a group through another group's lens is fraught with peril.

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by justratsinacoat on Wednesday May 11, 2016 @01:32PM (#11677330)
>Tax cuts marketed as economic stimulus, attacks on regulations and consumer/environmental protections marketed as 'making government more efficient', racial oppression disguised as drug/crime laws, universal health care spun as death panels, etc...

Kind of odd -- everyone immediately jumps down parent's throat, but it's not like tax cuts for 'job creators' and universal health care as 'death panels' aren't actual factual conservative talking points, part of an easily verifiable historical record (I'll concede the "attacks on regulations and consumer/environmental protections marketed as 'making government more efficient'"). I presume those that speak those views are No True Conservatives?

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by lintiness on Monday May 09, 2016 @04:23PM (#11662832)
case in point.
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by dragonwriter on Monday May 09, 2016 @05:13PM (#11663260)
> Jonathan Haidt has shown in his work on ideological bias is that liberals are unable to accurately understand the conservative worldview

Actually (without getting into methodological issues and whether he has actually shown anything), the conclusion would be more accurately stated as that liberal are unable to accurately predict the manner in which conservatives would prefer to express their worldview, whereas the reverse is not true.

I think that, to the extent this is accurate at all (and this type of research on broadly characterizing liberals and conservatives, from either side, is fraught with opportunities -- often realized -- to take broad fuzzy terms and operationalize them in ways which reinforces researchers' own ideological biases), what it really reflects is the fact that liberals in-group language is the same as the common language of the broader society and, particularly, entertainment media (to which, then, moderates and conservatives are still heavily exposed), whereas conservatives in-group language is something to which liberals are far less exposed (mainly propagated through conservative churches and similar institutions).

(This is also feeds -- though its not the sole source of -- the liberal view of conservative dishonesty, in that the main context in which liberals encounter conservative in-group language is in conservative advocacy of public policy positions, where the language used to articulate conservative values is used in a way which clashes with liberals expected use of language, and seems dishonest when it comes to values.)

Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by wdmeldon on Monday May 09, 2016 @03:19PM (#11662378)
The quote "Conservatives think Liberals are stupid, Liberals think Conservatives are evil" seems to apply here.
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by lintiness on Monday May 09, 2016 @02:39PM (#11662067)
it's a lot easier exaggerating, belittling, and dismissing the "other" than it is challenging one's own positions.
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by popmystack on Monday May 09, 2016 @05:03PM (#11663189)
Much like the majority of posts in your comment history?
Re:Former Facebook Workers: We Routinely Suppressed Conserva... by popmystack on Monday May 09, 2016 @04:33PM (#11662916)
I don't think it's a case of me misunderstanding, I could have easily provided other examples of view points that are largely not covered or ignored because they do not hold merit. Not that this really adds negates what you said, but I used to be a conservative (and not in the vein of the caricature I was employing), it'd be hard for me to misunderstand a position I once held some years ago.

There comes a time where experience and evidence will just not go your way, no matter how many what-ifs and "if you would just listen"'s you throw at opposing parties. You cannot add credibility to your position based on unknowns and chance.

Making sure there is an artificial level playing ground between two sides is pointless. I don't believe this is a case of people stifling view points, but rather the view point in question just not holding any merit.

Equating that to censorship is silly. Furthermore utilizing questionable sources to further a point isn't going to help your view point either.