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Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by Mithaldu on Sunday March 20, 2016 @10:00PM (#11325725)
The problem is, as ActionButton argues in this review of Diablo 2 [0], Starcraft is a game that may contain some amount of strategy, but wherein the element of strategy is strongly over-powered by a reflex-based combat system more akin to Street Fighter than anything else.

[0] http://www.actionbutton.net/?p=518

Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by TulliusCicero on Sunday March 20, 2016 @10:06PM (#11325750)
If that was true, then bots would already easily dominate humans, just like they can for fighting games.

But they don't; even moderately competitive players can beat the best bots.

Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by Umn44 on Monday March 21, 2016 @11:49AM (#11328890)
"But they don't; even moderately competitive players can beat the best bots."

That's because the programmers are bad at AI for that kind of game. It just means human beings don't understand how to make a good AI for a game like starcraft. AKA the human being being the idiot that doesn't understand how to make one.

Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by ktRolster on Sunday March 20, 2016 @10:11PM (#11325769)
wherein the element of strategy is strongly over-powered by a reflex-based combat system

This isn't true, in general a bigger army will beat a smaller army every time.

After you can make equal size armies, the next problem is army positioning and when to take engagements.

Finally, after you can do all that, then you can get an extra bonus to your power by microing really well. But not every micro is about speed - most of the time it's about knowing what to do.

And even at the most extreme, it's less about clicking quickly and more about clicking precisely.

Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by drwl on Sunday March 20, 2016 @10:36PM (#11325843)
It's not always the case where smaller armies lose to big armies. There are many situations in Starcraft where superior micro of less units can taken on more units. One example is Phoenixes versus mutalisks. For those who don't play, Phoenixes are faster and have slightly longer range than mutalisks. Phoenixes can infinitely shoot and run and kill of mutalisks.
Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by TulliusCicero on Monday March 21, 2016 @02:44AM (#11326583)
I'm not sure this is true, even with infinite APM micro, and I have a whole of experience microing phoenixes against mutas. Well, maybe after the range upgrade it is.
Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by drwl on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:17AM (#11326932)
you're right - the phoenixes will take damage. They'll take virtually nothing with range upgrade. But this 6 v 22 trade off https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6g1GCzJfCKo
Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by ktRolster on Monday March 21, 2016 @01:50AM (#11326444)
That's true, I should have added "unit composition" in there right after "army size"
Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by dwaltrip on Sunday March 20, 2016 @10:41PM (#11325859)
The strategic complexity of StarCraft is easily several orders of magnitude above Street Fighter.
Re:DeepMind Challenges for StarCraft by StavrosK on Sunday March 20, 2016 @10:46PM (#11325877)
The GP didn't disagree. He said that the strategic component is overpowered by the need for reflexes.