Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by coldcode on Thursday January 28, 2016 @08:09AM
(#10987893)
It's not illegal unless you have standing to challenge it in court. Standing is used by government (at least in the US) to allow all sorts of likely illegal activities but without a court explicitly making it illegal they can get away with almost anything.
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Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by geggam on Thursday January 28, 2016 @08:50AM
(#10988080)
What happened to common sense spirit of the law violations ? The 4th amendment is plain English. Why do we let lawyers pollute the system with "translations"
Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by mikeash on Thursday January 28, 2016 @10:12AM
(#10988577)
It may be plain English, but it's also highly ambiguous English. Who decides what is "unreasonable"? I agree that they've taken this stuff way too far, but that doesn't mean that my idea of the text is the "plain English" interpretation, and theirs is the "lawyerly translation" version.
Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by geggam on Thursday January 28, 2016 @10:50AM
(#10988850)
But the spirit remains the same. The concept is you are safe from search without a warrant. If they are able to apply copyright to digital media then its assumed the same as paper. If it is assumed the same as paper then it seems obvious that its safe from search.
Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by mikeash on Thursday January 28, 2016 @11:41AM
(#10989212)
The plain English wording says that you are safe from unreasonable searches. Everything hinges on the interpretation of "reasonable," which is not a matter of "plain English" because plain English doesn't define "reasonable" with sufficient precision.
Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by TrevorJ on Thursday January 28, 2016 @09:57PM
(#10993197)
In what world is using a damn airplane to get the location of mass numbers of people by exploiting their cell phones considered reasonable? It's ridiculous that people aren't in jail over this kind of bullshit.
Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by geggam on Thursday January 28, 2016 @11:48AM
(#10989283)
only for lawyers... its obvious the concept is to protect citizens from govt dragnets... to anyone who isnt attempting to pervert the spirit of the law
Re:California Police Used Stingrays in Planes to Spy on Phones
by mikeash on Thursday January 28, 2016 @11:54AM
(#10989334)
You've gone from "plain English" to "spirit of the law" which is way different.
Again, I agree with you, but this position is not something you arrive at by just reading the 4th Amendment and then understanding its words without legal context.