Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI

Re:Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI by iheartmemcache on Thursday January 07, 2016 @01:43AM (#10856396)

This looks like it includes C#, VB.NET, F#, and any other language that targets the CLR (Common Language Runtime, i.e., Microsoft's JVM). edit: Apparently not. Mea culpa!

Also, I don't know how long ago you tried Mono + VB, but especially since MS started collaborating with Mono and offering upstream first-party support (~2 years), support for the IL has been almost production quality. (Now it is production quality - I'm running some of my customer ASP.NET applications which was built around the NHibernate rather than EF/MS SQL on full Linux infrastructure).

Satya is making a ton of bold moves that are basically antithetical compared to the Ballmer-era MS. Visual Studio Code (yet-another-electron-based-editor) and Community, along with the ridiculous amount of open stuff on Github has effectively eliminated the vendor-lock-in stronghold that Microsoft previously had. Residual Office renewals and upgrades on the MS SQL stack will only get them so far. They're going full Docker[1] support on the new Windows Server stack, as well as full .NET support off the Windows stack, which is interesting to say the least. I wonder if we'll start seeing them buying out companies that are traditionally aligned with more-open-sourcey.

A bold move they could make would be buying out Cognitect. Datomic could be a perfect fit for them. Integrate Visual Studio support (e.g. as good as IntelliJ/Cursive) and give CLJS first-party support (let Nolen take a lead spot on the TypeScript team) in VS and it could be a steal at even a few hundred million dollars. The talent (Hickey+Nolen) the developers who they bring over + the perception shift within the dev community + the Datomic itself is likely worth a half a billion to MS.

[1] http://www.hanselman.com/blog/BrainstormingDevelopmentWorkfl...

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Re:Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI by enricosada on Thursday January 07, 2016 @05:02AM (#10857067)

F# support is in progress, next beta i think. pull requests got merged last week

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Re:Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI by Flow on Thursday January 07, 2016 @06:03AM (#10857244)

TypeScript(and even C#) is a huge step backwards compared to Clojure and ClojureScript. Immutability is a clumsy thing in TypeScript whereas it's concise and natural in Clojure and ClojureScript.

I doubt a bright person such as David Nolen would like to work with TypeScript as it is right now.

IMHO of course.

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Re:Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI by iheartmemcache on Thursday January 07, 2016 @06:31AM (#10857351)

I'm pretty sure a few tens of millions (lets say Nolen has 5% equity? I think give or take a few points, that's about right) for 4 years (generally the buy-out terms for a pair of golden-handcuffs) and the freedom to choose the direction in which TS goes (notice I did say "Lead" -- his role would have to be essentially Anders or Meijer's level for it to go through I'm sure) would be equally amenable for all parties involved. (I don't think you understand the freedom engineers at that level in MS get, especially post-Ballmer). Immutability sucks in TS? Oh well, here David, take 5-10 SDEs and do whatever you want.

MS gets the Clojure (and maybe more importantly the CLJS userbase), Cognitect gets massive reach (CLJS is subsidized solely by the licensing of Datomic by strict revenue), MS' corporate customers get Datomic. Just going by the direction MS has been in lately ("embrace & extend") under the new anti-Ballmer role, floating an offer of 300-500 million would be beneficial to everyone involved. Let's say there are conservatively 100k Clj(s) users out there right now using Clojure + Sun's JVM. At 300 million that's 3k per active developer acquired right off the bat. You'll lose maybe 10% of the users who live-by-their-Macbook-and-die-by-their-iPhone. Even at 600 million, that's still a cheap price to pay.

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Re:Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI by gelasio on Friday January 08, 2016 @02:00PM (#10867270)

I'd say immutability is just about the only thing that's concise in Clojure/Script and everything else about it is a huge step backwards - especially the lisp syntax. Yuck! (Also IMHO.)

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Re:Exploring the new .NET “dotnet” CLI by donatj on Thursday January 07, 2016 @01:54AM (#10856431)

It was maybe 2 or 3 years ago I poked around in it and failed to get much to run.

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