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Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by gootdude on Monday November 23, 2015 @12:36PM (#10615841)
Lenovo uses Microsoft Windows Platform Binary Table to install bloatware, which gets around any kind of clean install/reset.

Clean install for Windows means nothing when you have shady vendors utilizing this mechanism.

Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by mikeash on Monday November 23, 2015 @01:02PM (#10616028)
I would change that last part to say "means nothing when you have shady OS makers building this mechanism."

I mean, come on, Microsoft, what were you thinking? Vendors gonna vend, so you had to know how this "feature" was going to be used.

Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by gootdude on Monday November 23, 2015 @01:34PM (#10616267)
Microsoft created the feature so you'd actually have driver support when doing the reset. I'm sure we all love resetting a touch screen only machine to find out it has no touch support for the install.
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by mikeash on Monday November 23, 2015 @03:24PM (#10617061)
Perhaps this would encourage vendors to actually follow standards for their input devices so they didn't require custom drivers. Win-win!
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by thescriptkiddie on Monday November 23, 2015 @02:54PM (#10616858)
They could have just put the drivers on the CD like every linux distro ever.
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by r00fus on Monday November 23, 2015 @04:11PM (#10617330)
You mean the CD recovery image disk which would ostensibly have all the same bloat/spyware as the PC itself?
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by thescriptkiddie on Monday November 23, 2015 @05:44PM (#10617899)
No, I mean the official Windows CD (technically two DVD set now). New Windows versions are shipping frequently enough now that it would actually be possible.
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by j_h_s on Monday November 23, 2015 @05:57PM (#10617958)
Microsoft could maintain specific install mediums for each device, including the drivers necessary, but without allowing vendors to load crapware
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by _lce0 on Monday November 23, 2015 @01:02PM (#10616023)
What about installing an intermediate linux system?

Like

  1. start with window pre-installed
  2. install any linux distro, fully overwriting the OEM
  3. re-install windows, from microsoft 
I'd say just stop at step 2 ;) but I can understand that not everybody can do this (eg: work computer) but want a clean OS.

will this method work to remove such bloatware?

Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by morcheeba on Monday November 23, 2015 @01:09PM (#10616080)
This won't work because the firmware will write a file to your hard drive with the bloatware. It's scary that firmware will modify my filesystem - lots of damage could happen here.

Also, instead of step 2, it would make more sense to boot linux on a usb stick and use dd to erase the hard drive -- this is more complete than installing another OS... but still useless if the firmware is working against you.

Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by lmz on Monday November 23, 2015 @02:27PM (#10616662)
In this case Windows will write to your filesystem, not the firmware. Of course there is nothing stopping a firmware from writing to the disk before it loads any OS, but that is true with any OS not just Windows.
Re:Dell shipping laptop with rogue self-signed root CA by mikeash on Monday November 23, 2015 @01:03PM (#10616033)
It won't work unless you manage to flash the UEFI firmware.