taking_counsel

Yep, that's my feeling too. I don't know why more people aren't angry about these kinds of clauses?! It boils my piss, I've spent 15+ years developing skills, and I am still now allowed to own the fruits of my labour, produced on my own time and dime!

Thanks. Are you aiming for any specific type of employers? SME? Big companies? Start-ups? Every company I've come across say (paraphrasing):

* "It's boilerplate; we can't change it!"

* "We never enforce it, do what you want."

* "Do what you want, who's gonna know?!"

* or some blanket legal statement: "Either your projects fall outside the scope of the clause, in which case you don't need to worry about said clauses, or they fall within the scope of the clause, in which case we are not wavering anything. And finally, its up to you, not us, to judge whether the project falls inside or out of said clause."

I've yet to come across a UK tech company (or R&D company) that has ever taken my concerns seriously. It's starting to bum me out. I don't want to work on releasable products knowing deep down that I might not actually own them.

Thanks for the comment. Yeah, I asked a lawyer check out my last contract, which had the same thing. I'm just trying to gauge how common this is. A lot of employers don't seem to want to remove said clauses.

It's all a bit chicken and egg. You need leverage to get said clauses removed, but to have such leverage, you need to be somebody in demand ... which means you usually need to have at some point realised something of value yourself, which you can't do if you down own the IP rights.

Yeah, I fell into this trap with early employers too. But refuse to do so going forward. As I posted above, I am currently delaying with a potential employer that just doesn't want to engage in the process (they are not the first), and I'm wondering how common this is. It's really pushing me towards self-employment.

Thanks for the advice.

"My best advice is to be transparent with your (potential?) employer (assuming you have nothing to hide) and let them know what you do outside of work hours and see if they will amend your contract suitably."

So I'm in this situation at the moment, and I did exactly this. I sought an employment lawyer's advice with my previous contract, any they suggested in future that I do exactly this.

I asked HR/legal for a "background IP form" or "prior list of inventions form" (it goes by different names), so I could list my project and ensure that they approve it.

I revived a blanket response from legal stating that I didn't need such a form because: either my projects fall outside the scope of the clause, in which case I don't need to worry about it, or they fall within the scope of the clause, in which case they are not wavering anything. And finally that it's up to me to judge whether the project fall inside or out of said clause.

Not overly helpful. I've tried to play it safe by getting approval, but it seems to have lead to a dead end. Not sure hiring a lawyer at this point is worth it if the company is entirely unwilling to engage in the standard professional processes.