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Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by patmcc on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @06:38PM (#9065966)
I really can't imagine 100% unemployment, because I think there will always be a demand for actual human people in some roles: hairdresser, waiter, singer, prostitute, masseuse, athlete, actor, croupier, etc.

Will robots/AI be good enough to do all these jobs? Sure, they might even be now. But as long as some people want to be sung to / served by / entertained by an actual flesh-and-blood human, there will still be employment in those sectors. In fact I wouldn't be surprised in the far future if those service positions were the most valuable in society, since that's where real scarcity will be.

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by pornel on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @06:57PM (#9066070)
Maybe some of these jobs won't be replaced with a robot, but will become completely irrelevant/unnecessary?

Instead of having a robot hairdresser, what if cutting hair wasn't even a thing? e.g. maybe we'll all get holo-wigs that let us change hairstyles as easily as profile pictures.

Similarly we don't talk to switchboard operators to enter URL in the browser addressbar. We've got AI that does it better and doesn't judge :)

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by TeMPOraL on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:03PM (#9066103)
Exactly. And yes, in principle we could keep inventing completely random and absurd jobs just to keep people busy earning for living - but then, what's the point? Nowdays we have to work because resources are scarce. If we reach the point of post-scarcity, forcing people to slave away their lives for food and shelter seems just evil.
Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by patmcc on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:13PM (#9066159)
I wasn't suggesting we invent jobs to keep people busy - I think we should strive towards employment being required for no one. Once food and material goods are post-scarcity, absolutely they should be provided to all.

But as long as anything is scarce (and experiences are, broadly, and I don't think there's any way around that), we'll have something like "employment". It might start at "I'll sing you a song if you massage my back" barter-style, but that evolves into currency eventually.

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by TeMPOraL on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:25PM (#9066200)
Ok, maybe you weren't suggesting that but I see this tossed around quite often - that people will always find new jobs and therefore we can keep requiring everyone to work for sustenance. And we're inventing many bullshit jobs right now - not to look too far, half of the work done in web development is probably contributing to nothing else than zero-sum games of companies trying to out-advertise one another.

I agree - as long as resources required for basic survival are scarce, there will be employment. But the point is, we shouldn't try to maintain the status quo as long as possible; we should jump to letting people live without a job the first moment this becomes feasible.

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by dragonwriter on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:31PM (#9066221)
> But as long as anything is scarce (and experiences are, broadly, and I don't think there's any way around that), we'll have something like "employment".

If labor isn't scarce (e.g., if there are easy substitutes that provide the utility provided by labor), then there's no real basis for employment even if there is scarcity in goods.

Scarcity guarantees that people will have an incentive to sacrifice to get scarce goods, but if labor isn't scarce, then sacrificing time in the form of labor isn't likely to be an option to do that.

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by TeMPOraL on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:01PM (#9066090)
So the question is - do we really want to keep our market economy and see if it will work out if entire population of the planet works as prostitutes?
Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by chongli on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:52PM (#9066339)
Sure and there will always be some demand for horses for various purposes but the total demand for horse labour is way below its peak in 1915. Do you foresee any future technology which might reinvigorate the demand for horses?
Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by patmcc on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @08:07PM (#9066401)
Increased human unemployment might, actually. If both cost and time weren't huge barriers, I expect more people would ride.

But I think the future for humans looks somewhat similar to that of horses today; a small number of us will still be "working", but more because of individual preferences than any kind of need.

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by TeMPOraL on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @08:14PM (#9066427)
It's not about cost and time; horse maintenance is more labour intensive, and then there's a problem of waste. Actually shortly before the first automobile was constructed, London authorities were worried that if the demand for horses keeps increasing, the city will literally be drowned in manure.
Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by guelo on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @07:45PM (#9066304)
hairdresser: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccP-ayh6Wlc

waiter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBuIhH9aaSA

singer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kM3n64WJmo

prostitute: soon (fleshlight+occulus)

masseuse: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004BXJZB2/ref=as_li_tl?ie=...

athlete: http://robogames.net/index.php

actor: there are tons of CGI actors in movies

croupier: slot machines, video poker, etc

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by patmcc on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @08:01PM (#9066371)
My point wasn't that elements of those jobs couldn't be done (or even done better, by some measures) by machines, but that there exist people with a strong preference to humans in those jobs.

Take croupiers; we have very good video poker, automated roulette tables, virtual blackjack, but still lots of humans dealing out cards (especially in the high roller rooms). I was at a casino in Las Vegas two weeks ago; the robot roulette gave strictly better payouts (36 to 1) than the human-run table (35 to 1) for single number bets, but there were still people at the tables.

Re:100% Unemployment: on keeping busy when the robots take over by TeMPOraL on Tuesday February 17, 2015 @08:17PM (#9066442)
There no doubt will always be demand for something to be done by humans, just because we're kind of a whimsy species. But I see no way for such jobs to become the basis of the economy. We need to end the concept that everyone has to work for a living. Otherwise it's not the 100% automation that will kill us, it's the 50% automation, i.e. half of the population not being able to earn their bread.