You can certainly be a non-idiotic PHP programmer, and there may certainly be just as many good PHP programmers as there are good programmers for any other language. But you, and they, are outnumbered by the bad "this is my first language and first project" programmers, who tend to adopt PHP for that purpose. and because of that, if you know nothing else about a programmer, knowing that they primarily program in PHP should tend to be Bayesian evidence against their programming skill/experience, just like knowing someone lives in India should tend to be Bayesian evidence against the likelihood of them being wealthy, or knowing someone likes {pop, classic rock, modern country} music should be Bayesian evidence against the diversity of their taste in music. It's not that there aren't tons of counterexamples; it's that there's this one huge overlapping subgroup that happens to have that property, and dominates any statistical effects. (Respectively, "people learning their first language"; "people born in poverty with no way out"; and "people who only listen to music provided by their single local radio station.")
Of course, if some other language were easier to learn than PHP, the dominating subgroup of "people who know 0.5 programming languages" would become attached to that language instead of PHP. So the fact that this group is attached to PHP is actually a point in favour of PHP as a platform. It's still a point against its statistical median user.
I get that you didn't intend it as an insult, and you probably didn't have people like me in mind when you made that comment. However, the relatively recent "PHP programmers are stupid" thing has so turned me off to any kind of programming discussion that I now habitually avoid any discussion of programming at all -- for the first time in all my years as a programmer.
It doesn't matter if there's 10 or 10 million PHP developers, it's still insulting. You sell a product online, and you've now alienated a large developer community. I'll never recommend or sign up for tarsnap now.
It wasn't a better solution. It was one of many alternatives which came to mind; but I offered them the best solution (serve the graphs from a PHP script) and the easiest solution (run a cron job to delete the old graphs).
The implication in your word choice came across as unfair and elitist.
> EDIT: To elaborate: I'm definitely not saying that all PHP developers are idiots. But PHP is a much easier language to learn than many others, so it gains a lot of users at the low end of the ability spectrum. There are just as many talented and security-aware Windows users as there are talented and security-aware Debian users, but there are far more untalented and security-unaware Windows users.
Okay, that's a fair statement. I thought you were calling ME an idiot :P
Not at all. Until now I didn't realize you were a PHP developer.
Would you not be defensive if you were called an idiot because of the language you choose to program in? Every time PHP comes up in these forums someone makes a smart-ass comment about how PHP developers are somehow lesser. THAT is why I get defensive, because of how celebrated and rampant it is here to treat PHP developers like complete shit.
Your account is just as old as mine and while I don't know how active you are on PHP-related threads, it's something I see time and time again here. It's a cancer in this community and when you see it and hear it as much as I do it becomes a serious burden.
No other group of programmers is stigmatized like PHP devs are for seemingly no other reason than how many bad ones there are. Yes there are bad PHP developers, but the blanket dismissal is, in fact, bigotry!
Woah. Deep breath.
PHP is a legitimate tool. Great for some things. Less great for others. Knowing how to use a tool can't make you an idiot, or bad at what you do.
If you only know how to use one tool, you're likely bad at your job, and/or the n00b that we're talking about as the butt of the "PHP developer" joke: The guy who implements something by following a tutorial and modifying small bits, until he gets used to the language.
Except, guess what - we're all "that guy" when we're in a new language. We start at README.md, a.k.a. step 1. We're making fun of ourselves when we first tried to do $x in $y without realizing that (naturally!! dumb noob!) in $y you actually do $x via $asdf. And even further back, when we started out with.. BASIC? PHP? Something inviting. Come to think about it... A lot of really good developers, who later may have transitioned to other languages, have probably started out with PHP.
But I digress. I've always thought that the php-devs-are-bad joke is just a more instantiated version of $noobs-are-bad.
I identify as a PHP developer. I owe PHP. I've worked with PHP extensively and would implement in it again, if and when it were appropriate. I don't get mad at PHP dev jokes. If I'm called a bad developer because I know a language more than them (and not a joke to lighten the mood or something), then the wielder of the argument is truly the idiot[1]. You may as well be saying "long division is retarded" because you just do it on the iPhone, man, or "French Speakers are idiots".
PS: This is my read on it. I try to live by an expanded Hanlon's razor ("Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by... $x") and also happen to believe that when you get upset/offended over trivialities, you "give power away". Being overly sensitive only ends up hurting yourself.
[1] And you have to wonder - does he even know that the hammer can also remove nails?
Obviously you're right in what you said, but I definitely do not see it falling under Hanlon's Razor and I definitely don't think everyone (or even most) people who bash PHP see it the way you do.
I'm sorry that I offended you, that was certainly not my intention. I'm puzzled as to how that got through, I thought I was careful in my tone. Fair enough.
> Obviously you're right in what you said, but I definitely do not see it falling under Hanlon's Razor
I said "expanded Hanlon's Razor" - meaning that I've found that many more things get misattributed as malice. In this case, the bad PHP dev meme[1] has permeated or sub-culture. That has happened already. It is done. Can't undo it. Can't take it back.
If you attribute usage of that meme to malice every time, and escalate it into bigotry in your head, you're "going to have a bad time" [sic]
I see where you're coming from, but calling discrimination & bigotry is one step too far in the opposite direction.
[1] And again, yes it is a bad meme, but it is actually about one-trick-pony noob devs. Not you, not me. Keep that in mind.