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Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by nutate on Wednesday November 26, 2014 @10:26PM (#8665850)
From sources... Amazon is a heavy Java -> Scala shop. They are probably looking at Clojure to diversify as Scala is hitting some growing pains, but they can still leverage their large JVM expertise.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by l8erCode on Thursday November 27, 2014 @03:01AM (#8666392)
From sources... There's not much overlap between the Scala and Clojure folk, so nothing to do with any "growing pains". Scala's seeing much more uptake than Clojure.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by nutate on Friday November 28, 2014 @09:09PM (#8672850)
Yeah, I can't imagine someone who's proficient with Scala seeing anything special in Clojure. I'm just a sight-seer in those languages, but I can see there are some neat things in both.

Parenthesis are always offputting to me, even though I like a fair amount of clojure concepts. I often feel like functional programming has made a cottage industry around putting obfuscated names around relatively simple ideas (see transducers for example)

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by saosebastiao on Thursday November 27, 2014 @02:31AM (#8666338)
Amazon actually has a pretty interesting history with Lisp. I believe Steve Yegge has written about it before, but I'm not sure. It was pretty much completely gone by the time I got there though. Amazon went from almost completely C++/Lisp to almost completely Java/Ruby over the course of about 5 years.

I'm not directly in the dev space, but it appears as though the choice of languages that people use has far more to do with what Builder Tools will support than what people actually want to use. Teams only use Scala or Clojure if they are willing to build it using their convoluted Ant wrapper that doesn't make any sense.

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by deepGem on Wednesday November 26, 2014 @11:49PM (#8666035)
Just out of curiosity, what are the pains with Scala that clojure will heal.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by threeseed on Thursday November 27, 2014 @12:00AM (#8666062)
Scala is a combination of OO and Functional. As such there is this "grey" in the middle that is confusing and complex.

Combine that with Scala's bewildering type system and I can see why companies move to Java or Clojure.

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by digitalzombie on Thursday November 27, 2014 @01:11AM (#8666193)
Totally agree with you.

I was really into Scala and studying it and everything. I still remember all the scala bloggers I follow, Daniel, Tim MOrris, Paul Snively, etc...

Eventually I landed into a scala job role. Oh boy was it different. The other programmers were like type casting to Any or whatever that generalize highest type was (unified type theory).

The complexity is pretty high, it's great if you know it all but in all seriousness it was impeding...

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by deepGem on Thursday November 27, 2014 @07:19AM (#8666913)
That's just bad usage of a language feature don't you think. I'm still trying to figure out whether to blame the language because of the way programmers use it.

Personally, I like the object + static typing + first class functions as it eliminates 90% of errors at compile time. If any error occurs at run time, am pretty sure it's logical. This is a huge plus. The only drawback - the ridiculous amount of type specific code you have to write for mundane changes/updates.

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by disputin on Thursday November 27, 2014 @01:34PM (#8668367)
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by saryant on Thursday November 27, 2014 @01:17AM (#8666204)
> The other programmers were like type casting to Any or whatever that generalize highest type was (unified type theory).

As a Scala dev, that is absolutely terrifying. I can't even begin to think of a good reason for that.

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by codygman on Thursday November 27, 2014 @03:13AM (#8666417)
It sounds like a Haskell programmer using unsafePerformIO everywhere. Or, perhaps a more apt example would be using Data.Dynamic for everything.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by saryant on Thursday November 27, 2014 @03:40AM (#8666456)
Yeah, casting to Any isn't a "grey area" in Scala's OO/Functional mix, it's just plain crazy.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by carterschonwald on Thursday November 27, 2014 @10:45AM (#8667641)
Those are still pretty safe to do. OTOH, Any drops everything on the floor
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by michaelochurch on Thursday November 27, 2014 @11:43AM (#8667952)
unsafePerformIO is for quiche eaters. Real programmers use accursedUnutterablePerformIO.

(Ok, but in all seriousness... don't.)

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by michaelochurch on Thursday November 27, 2014 @11:46AM (#8667964)
Scala with mediocre programmers (CommodityScrumDrones writing FactoryVisitor classes) is an outright disaster.

The Java community has its flaws (oh boy, does it) but it has adapted to the hordes of mediocrities. Give Scala to mediocre engineers (who typecast to Any, use null instead of Option[T]) and you have the Java hell with worse IDE support and 5x compile times.

Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by frowaway001 on Thursday November 27, 2014 @11:56AM (#8668005)
It's quite easy to disallow all of that.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by saryant on Thursday November 27, 2014 @01:36PM (#8668376)
Yeah, pretty sure you could get WartRemover or one of the other static analysis tools to disallow these sort of egregious violations.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by codeonfire on Thursday November 27, 2014 @08:54AM (#8667265)
Amazon is literally thousands of shops with a libertarian CEO. The fastest way to end a career there is to try to force a company-wide standard language although many have tried and failed.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by nso95 on Friday November 28, 2014 @01:39AM (#8669921)
Jeff is actually known for being a micromanager.
Re:Amazon is hiring Clojure devs by 1971genocide on Thursday November 27, 2014 @07:37PM (#8669247)
ppl in HN think in 2014 it really matters what language you use.