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Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by jacquesm on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @10:19AM (#8595791)
Funny, that was exactly my response to all this, if Linux insists on copying the worst of windows in the future then I'll be more than happy to go with FreeBSD. I'm a bit rusty but I'll survive.
Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by qznc on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @11:01AM (#8596115)
Isn't systemd actually doing it the BSD way (everything within one repository and tightly coupled)?
Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by jacquesm on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @11:06AM (#8596162)
Last I looked FreeBSD used rc.conf but it's years ago.

I don't see FreeBSD's init trying to absorb most of the userland system utilities.

Whether or not it is in one repository isn't really the issue at hand here. It is that a bunch of desktop related stuff is worming its way into the systems to the point where you'll be running a whole slew of new, buggy and sloppy code on your servers if you're not very careful just so that the systemd folks get to scratch their NIH itches.

Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by digi_owl on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @05:41PM (#8598753)
Everything in one repository, yes. Tightly coupled, no.

And even when in one repository i think you can grab the BSD utils without getting the kernel and whatsnot in one big tar-ball.

If you try to grab say just the dns daemon from systemd you can't do so directly. you would have to grab the tar-ball for the whole of systemd, and then attempt to extract just the parts dealing with the dns daemon.

Damn it, LFS have found doing this for udev so demanding that they have switched to eudev for their non-systemd edition (yep, they now have their own systemd edition going alongside the "traditional" one).

Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by rakoo on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @03:58PM (#8598108)
I think we've reached the point where we can start being pedantic about what "Linux" means.

I don't think the kernel developers care that much about what systemd is doing (except for the notorious clash about systemd interpreting a debug option meant for the kernel and crashing the boot...), so you can't say the kernel is copying or doing anything.

The distros, however, are possibly the ones you want to blame for pushing and supporting systemd. Which is actually funny because the way it's going, systemd is laying foundations for a new kind of linux distributions to which distributions will certainly have to adapt if they want to keep it.

Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by takeda on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @10:45AM (#8595976)
As a FreeBSD evangelist I actually like systemd :-P
Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by jacquesm on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @10:53AM (#8596046)
Right, because it drives people from linux to FreeBSD. Well, here is my take on that: the reason I run Linux is because my desktop runs linux, and I try to keep as little knowledge about systems in my head as I need to get through the day in one piece. Since FreeBSD lost more and more ground to linux when it came to supporting the kind of hardware that PCs (desktops) ship with I ended up standardizing on Linux. I know full well that if I switch back to FreeBSD I'll end up running it on my desktop as well and that's when I will probably regret my move. Let's hope the situation has improved over the years.

Systemd is a cancer, it will end up killing Linux if this goes on unchecked. At least Torvalds seems to (most of the time) know his stuff, the way they replaced the memory management left me with a bad taste but in the end it worked out. What's happening with Systemd is absolutely unpalatable and I hope that Redhat and other distros take note, there are a lot more Linux systems on servers than on Desktops and if they believe that expending all this effort on Linux on the desktop so they can better compete with Windows they might just lose their dominance on the server because of it.

Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by mhurron on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @12:29PM (#8596803)
> I hope that Redhat and other distros take note, there are a lot more Linux systems on servers than on Desktops and if they believe that expending all this effort on Linux on the desktop so they can better compete with Windows they might just lose their dominance on the server because of it.

Red Hat is developing systemd. It has nothing to do with making Linux palatable on the desktop, but a severe case of NIH, which to be honest is hardly new in Linux-land.

systemd won't kill Linux. Linux development is out of the hands of hobbyists and enthusiasts now and corporate users and developers don't care about the holy wars. Red Hat ships systemd, Red Hats users will use systemd and that will be that.

Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by digi_owl on Wednesday November 12, 2014 @05:46PM (#8598777)
RH is pushing heavily into cloud computing, and appears to use systemd to do so (notice the amount of containerization talk there is in relation to systemd these days).

Their existing server customers are likely to be sitting on RHEL7 for quite some time. And i suspect that the workstation customers, mostly military as best i can tell, are in part pushing for systemd. Logind etc after all is heavily focused on multi-seats.

Re:Systemd-resolved DNS cache poisoning by retrogradeorbit on Thursday November 13, 2014 @12:46AM (#8600121)
I'm one who you speak of. Systemd to me is just a scarily large attack surface. Working through my servers slowly replacing them with FreeBSD. ZFS raid root out of the box on install! That one really impressed me.