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Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by staunch on Sunday July 06, 2014 @01:25AM (#7993852)
Poking "areas" of a massive organ with a stick vs direct manipulation of DNA at the molecular level.
Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by amirmc on Sunday July 06, 2014 @02:13AM (#7993913)
Those things can be just as crude as each other. Genes (and proteins) can interact in very complex ways so don't be fooled into thinking that 'direct manipulation' of specific parts means you have any idea what's going on.

As a software analogy, think about a very large and complex, undocumented code-base in a bizarre language you've never come across. Your only experimental tool is to pick a line of code, delete/modify it, and then see what happens. As you learn more, you can do refine your experiments but basically, you're still just 'poking it with a stick'.

Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by lifeisstillgood on Sunday July 06, 2014 @03:28AM (#7993999)
Any attempt to use the above information will result in a breach of my patent USPO12345678, "A novel method of software maintenance using and IDE and a stick"
Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by marcosdumay on Sunday July 06, 2014 @09:47AM (#7994508)
> and a stick

We call that a "debugger" around here. You are expected to know the jargon before applying for patents.

Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by lifeisstillgood on Sunday July 06, 2014 @01:04PM (#7994992)
Oddly, my boss calls it a 'motivator' - with a nail in the end it's an 'incentive package'
Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by CodeDiver on Tuesday July 08, 2014 @01:42AM (#8003161)
Toggling big switches vs smaller switches. Same idea, different scale, different "stick".

What is/are the appropriate scales to study brain function at? Quarks? Molecules? Brain regions? Which ones? All the above? None? We need to know the answer in advance before pronouncing a method "crude", or conversely, "too precise", by some criteria.

We don't know the answer to the scale question but poking "areas" to build up a fuzzy picture of regional function at first approximation is getting us there.

Would the knowledge gained from knock-out/stimulation experiments be more fine-grained if the investigators already had a fine-grained understanding of what they were studying and thus, the cleanest way to study it? Yes.

But breakthroughs are not made where investigators know what they're doing. Breakthroughs are made where nobody knows what they're doing--often crudely, frequently accidentally. The history of scientific advance is messy. Significance of results doesn't map neatly to sophistication of methods/tools.

I wholly agree that neuroscience has a long way to go. But to me that doesn't diminish the achievements of neuroscientists pushing us there, using whatever ethical opportunities available to them.

Re:Consciousness on-off switch discovered deep in brain by krisgee on Sunday July 06, 2014 @10:30AM (#7994586)
You can make anything sound daft by expressing it a certain way. The entire history of physics, all the way from cavemen to the LHC, is just a story of smashing rocks together in creative ways and watching what happens.

But obviously it's a lot more than that, and so is electric brain stimulation.