A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son

Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by refurb on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @02:50PM (#7939677)

It probably depends on the design of the sewer system, but an ex's father worked for the city sewer system. He was asked by police on one occasion to help out with a bust where they thought evidence was going to be flushed.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by rdtsc on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @03:05PM (#7939791)

From their point of view what is easier throw a flash grenade into a crib or build sewer shut-off valves through-out the city. Control them, repair them. Can you prove that these drugs belonged to this particular house. That this one person flushed them. What if they are 10 people in the house. Are they all drug dealers because they found pot flushed in some sewer trap?

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by dllthomas on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @04:54PM (#7940577)

"they found pot flushed in some sewer trap?"

How is that worse than "they found pot under the floorboards"?

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by rdtsc on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @05:12PM (#7940687)

It is not worse, it is still easier to throw a flash grenade in a crib.

Worst case they get time off with pay while and internal investigation by their friends determine that procedures are followed.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by dllthomas on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @06:36PM (#7941112)

This doesn't feel like a coherent response to my comment.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by rdtsc on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @09:18PM (#7941719)

That is their response. It is not coherent, but this is not propositional logic. This is a militarized force that cannot be punished for their abuses, can and does inflict those abuses as will and it attracts saddists and psychopaths that cover each other asses.

You are trying to come up with technical solutions (oh install sewer traps). The problem is not technical. It legal, and regulatory. There is no, 0, nada, zilch repercussion for just throwing a flash grenade in barge in. Why install sewer traps and spends all that money? That is irrational from their point of view.

The floor boards and all that sewer stuff is just noise. All those "problems" are just a list hurdles they will never and or even think about solving, that was the main point.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by danielweber on Wednesday June 25, 2014 @08:58AM (#7943591)

I appreciate that my thought pattern (asking about sewer traps) sure sounds a lot like a clueless nerd using his technology hammer to fix a social problem he figures must be a nail.

However, I am just gathering facts to figure out what other options are available to police. If certain states, as a citizen I am judged very harshly if I don't exhaust all options before using lethal force, even if it's happening in the heat of the moment. I want the cops to do the same consideration of their other options, at least when it's an operation they get to plan out ahead of time to happen under the time of their choosing.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by rrss1122 on Wednesday June 25, 2014 @11:00AM (#7944349)

Wanting the cops to do the same consideration of their other options is the regulatory and legal issue rdtsc was talking about. You want the cops to do that, you have to impose penalties that will actually be enforced on the cops, and the penalties have to be harsh.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by dllthomas on Wednesday June 25, 2014 @11:06AM (#7944403)

The penalties will have to be sufficient that the EV of breaking the rules is negative, but harshness should only be one tool in achieving that. It is more important that the penalties be inforced, and harshness can actually undermine that.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by dllthomas on Tuesday June 24, 2014 @10:17PM (#7941907)

They may not care, but the rest of us do.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by vsl on Wednesday June 25, 2014 @03:49AM (#7942714)

The point is that there's nothing you can do. You are not the one making the choice. Hence the only solution is to restrain the police.

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Re:A SWAT team blew a hole in my 2-year-old son by dllthomas on Wednesday June 25, 2014 @11:02AM (#7944370)

Sure, but my point goes to whether proposing sewer traps (or something similar) instead is an appropriate way of restraining the police.

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