Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vulnerabilities

Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by waps on Monday January 13, 2014 @08:44PM (#7054849)

Please note that the only way to exploit these vulnerabilities is you've already got your code executing on the machine you intend to break. The only thing this allows you to do is to break out of the java sandbox, and keep in mind that most languages don't even pretend that sandbox isolates code (e.g. python/perl/go/... all openly say you can easily break out of the sandbox). So they're trying to solve a really hard problem.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by tptacek on Monday January 13, 2014 @09:31PM (#7055002)

They are indeed trying to solve a hard problem, and they're shackled to a 1990s design.

But I'm not sure I understand the rest of your comment. The threat model for a Java plugin vulnerability is, if your target has the Java plugin enabled, they can't safely browse the web; any page they visit could end up redirecting them to a page with a malicious applet. That's pretty bad.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by taspeotis on Monday January 13, 2014 @08:50PM (#7054872)

    Please note that the only way to exploit these vulnerabilities is you've already got your code executing on the machine you intend to break

I can't reconcile this with the article.

    ...34 that are bugs that can be exploited remotely by an attacker without requiring authentication

By "your code" do you mean "Java-based application"? Honest question.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by waps on Monday January 13, 2014 @09:04PM (#7054926)

I mean that these bugs only solve the "break out of the sandbox" issue. They do not get your code on to the machine to exploit.

In other words these flaws are the equivalent of "I can upload code, how do I get to shell access to the java account".

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by girvo on Monday January 13, 2014 @09:57PM (#7055080)

Java Applets.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by cma on Monday January 13, 2014 @09:39PM (#7055034)

So basically, if someone browses to a site with an applet and doesn't block Java.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by taspeotis on Monday January 13, 2014 @10:08PM (#7055124)

I wouldn't call that a remote exploit.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by tptacek on Monday January 13, 2014 @10:23PM (#7055175)

Unlike the whole software security industry, which does.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by taspeotis on Monday January 13, 2014 @10:51PM (#7055256)

I don't work in the software security industry like you but I don't see how it's a remote exploit. Wikipedia gives a way of discerning the two [1] that makes sense to me, as a software security industry layperson:

> Whether they need to be run on the same machine as the program that has the vulnerability (local) or can be run on one machine to attack a program running on another machine (remote).

So if a user starts running the code for you on their machine, it's local. If I send a malformed JPG to a Java webservice that process images, and it doesn't process the JPG correctly leading to code execution or a DoS then that's remote.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exploit_(computer_security)

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by tptacek on Monday January 13, 2014 @11:18PM (#7055341)

That's a 1990s definition of the term "remote", but 51% of Wikipedians now disagree with the whole software security industry, which uniformly considers browser drive-by vulnerabilities to be "remote".

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by meowface on Tuesday January 14, 2014 @01:28AM (#7055708)

I agree, it's a local exploit, not a remote exploit (I've debated this with people as well), but in the end Java sandbox bypass exploits are (or were) the most effective local exploit possible. And they're arguably far more valuable than the vast majority of remote exploits out there.

Silent, cross-browser, cross-platform; browser plugin installed by default with anyone who has Java. And that's a huge number of people, since a ton of corporate and residential users have Java installed on all sorts of devices. Java is responsible for a massive ramp up in infections of computer literate and illiterate users alike between 2010 and now.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by brazzy on Tuesday January 14, 2014 @04:54AM (#7056210)

An interesting aspect of the whole Java pluigin fiasco is that, as you write, there were very few exploits until a couple of years ago - but the plugin was widely deployed for over a decade before that, and there is no reason to believe that it was somehow more secure before. So why the recent increase?

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by benmmurphy on Tuesday January 14, 2014 @05:22AM (#7056279)

I think it is a combination of third party bug bounty programs (ZDI, etc) which is causing vulnerabilities to be disclosed to the vendor and the blood in the water effect.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by meowface on Thursday January 16, 2014 @10:23PM (#7074092)

Could be a combination of many factors, but probably in part due to security researchers and black hats alike truly realizing the potential damage Java sandbox exploits could cause, in comparison to exploits for Flash or Adobe Reader, which are much more fickle, not cross platform, etc.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by toyg on Monday January 13, 2014 @09:25PM (#7054983)

Considering the crappy quality of most java-powered "enterprise" software, I'd say this scenario is extremely likely.

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Re:Oracle to issue huge security patch addressing 36 Java vu... by InclinedPlane on Monday January 13, 2014 @10:01PM (#7055096)

This is a very disingenuous way of describing the risk of drive by exploits in the browser.

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