News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:What I Didn't Say by mjburgess on Monday December 30, 2013 @08:34PM (#6988371)
> the most clueless people in those areas I know are tenured professors.

Not about the subjects they research. That is the purpose of research.

> are full of scorn for academia in general

All of those people are academics par execellance. I'm not talking about business-ified institutional academica. I'm talking about spending a long time on a topic, researching it and thinking deeply, clearly on it before you offer your opinion as though it were valuable.

> do a SPECIFIC critique of what he wrote somewhere

I have on one of his essays, but I took it seriously to write that critique.

The audience I would be targeting in a critique of the man (via a critique of his under-informed rants) are those who equate money with success and "money-making" with intelligence. I value my time too much to spend the amount required undoing that confusion.

Re:What I Didn't Say by sillysaurus2 on Monday December 30, 2013 @09:48PM (#6988649)
So, I should probably point out that pg went to Harvard specifically to study Philosophy. He earned a Doctor of Philosophy in 1990. Therefore your critique that he should have a degree before writing about philosophy is interesting.

All of those people are academics par execellance. I'm not talking about business-ified institutional academica. I'm talking about spending a long time on a topic, researching it and thinking deeply, clearly on it before you offer your opinion as though it were valuable.

pg spent weeks on each of his early essays. He spent a solid month writing What You Can't Say. He spent at least a couple days writing this one. They aren't opinion pieces.

Re:What I Didn't Say by throwawaykf03 on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @12:51AM (#6989249)
> pg spent weeks on each of his early essays. He spent a solid month writing What You Can't Say. He spent at least a couple days writing this one.

Stephenie Meyer spent years writing the Twilight books. Time spent on a work is in no way indicative on the quality of that work.

Re:What I Didn't Say by Crito on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @03:19AM (#6989611)
How are we measuring "quality"?

Reaction from literary critics? Reaction from the target audience? Financial success?

It seems to me that by two of those standards Stephenie Meyer knocked the ball out of the park. It is not clear to me why we should care about the other standard of quality.

Re:What I Didn't Say by throwawaykf03 on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @02:09PM (#6992235)
Analogously, pg's essays being very popular with a number of people in no way translates to other standards of quality :-) They may resonate with people, but without solid grounding in reality, they may be no better than "pop philosophy".

Personally, I agree with some of his essays, but on some others he's way off the mark. For instance, his writings on anything Hollywood or copyright-related betray a fundamental misunderstanding of what artists sell. Yet those essays were extremely popular simply because they confirmed people's biases (hence "pop philosophy"). However, if you check the so-called "blogosphere", you can find many others who have posted well-reasoned criticisms of those (and other) essays.

Re:What I Didn't Say by Crito on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @02:53PM (#6992481)
You won't have an argument from me there. I don't count myself among the PG fans.
Re:What I Didn't Say by mjburgess on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @05:59AM (#6989952)
> It is not clear to me why we should care about the other standard of quality.

Yeah, I think this is a fairly good characterization of pg's audience.

Re:What I Didn't Say by umanwizard on Monday December 30, 2013 @10:08PM (#6988703)
Do you honestly not know what a Ph.D is, or are you just making a flabbergastingly disingenuous argument? He has a doctorate in CS, not philosophy, despite the ceremonial Latin name of the degree.
Re:What I Didn't Say by coldtea on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @12:41AM (#6989223)
Instead of going on about a "flabbergastingly disingenuous argument" and blaming it on him not understanding that a Ph.D is not a philosophy degree (seriously? you think he doesn't know that?), it would have been much more productive, and correct, to assume he made the simple mistake of thinking pg has a Ph.D in philosophy, where in fact he has a B.A.
Re:What I Didn't Say by jacalata on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @04:33AM (#6989775)
Yes, I think he doesn't know that, and the way the comment was written seems to make that the obvious reading. What makes you so certain he does?
Re:What I Didn't Say by chris_wot on Monday December 30, 2013 @10:23PM (#6988755)
He seems to have made a mistake. pg has BA in philosophy.
Re:What I Didn't Say by chris_wot on Monday December 30, 2013 @10:15PM (#6988732)
I would consider this to be the definitive comment that puts to bed the argument being pushed.
Re:What I Didn't Say by mjburgess on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @05:57AM (#6989947)
I know his academic background. His article on philosophy cannot have taken "weeks" because it is so woeful.
Re:What I Didn't Say by chris_wot on Tuesday December 31, 2013 @07:41PM (#6993617)
Your credentialism and elitism doesn't impress me.
Re:What I Didn't Say by coldtea on Monday December 30, 2013 @08:55PM (#6988448)
>the most clueless people in those areas I know are tenured professors.

>>Not about the subjects they research. That is the purpose of research.

They are cluless _especially_ about the subjects they research.

Most philosophy, political economy etc academics are beyond mediocre -- not only in advancing their field, but even in understanding the greats who contributed to it and rightfully presenting their knowledge.

Most real development comes from outsiders to this system -- people incombatible with academic life, even if they happen to work as professors (like Adorno or Wittgenstein did for example). And that was true already in the '40s and '50s, were academic discourse and research freedom in those fields was extremelly better compared to (market driven, low quality, paper churn) today's reality.

>The audience I would be targeting in a critique of the man (via a critique of his under-informed rants) are those who equate money with success and "money-making" with intelligence.

Oh, those poor fools. Because there are other, proven, definitions of success that everybody should ascribe to, right?

>I value my time too much to spend the amount required undoing that confusion

Yep, I expected this part.

Re:What I Didn't Say by nordsieck on Monday December 30, 2013 @09:21PM (#6988539)
> Not about the subjects they research. That is the purpose of research.

The purpose of research is to farm grant money and citations. Any actual learning that happens during the process is beside the point.