Re:Amazon's German Workers Strike
by bluecalm on Monday December 16, 2013 @04:25PM
(#6917916)
The contract is only voluntary if both sides have other reasonable options. This is very important point and the biggest hole in American Libertarian view of the world. There is a reason slavery contracts are illegal as well as there is a reason for worker rights (wouldn't be necessary and could be negotiated for every contract by logic of voluntary contract - workers just wouldn't agree to worse conditions).
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Re:Amazon's German Workers Strike
by Houshalter on Monday December 16, 2013 @05:06PM
(#6918173)
It's still voluntary. I may have no choice but to eat food, but it isn't farmers that are forcing me to buy it.
Signing an agreement with a gun to your head is not voluntary. This is, after all, the normal complaint of the libertarian regarding the extortion of taxes, no?
Well the same logic applies when the "gun" is not physically a gun: If your set of viable choices has a size of 1 then you cannot be honestly said to have any "voluntary" choice.
Re:Amazon's German Workers Strike
by JanezStupar on Tuesday December 17, 2013 @05:44AM
(#6920432)
So in demand surplus, the farmer is exploiting consumers.
Does that mean that in supply surplus, the consumer is exploiting the farmer?
Phrasing world in the terms of zero sum game is really not the best idea.
Re:Amazon's German Workers Strike
by Houshalter on Tuesday December 17, 2013 @03:07AM
(#6920074)
As I said, the same is true of food or any other necessity. But we aren't going around claiming farmers are exploiting us.
The problem with the person holding a gun to your head scenario, is that they are abusing your rights in the first place by putting a gun to your head. We don't want people to do that for various reasons. But in this scenario it isn't the employer or farmer holding the gun, it's mother nature. They are just offering assistance from that.
The problem with that is that you see property rights as part of "mother nature". So if one side controls all the resources and can coerce the other to w/e they please you see it as "mother nature" on the other hand when I put a gun to your head it's no longer mother nature it's "abusing rights".
Re:Amazon's German Workers Strike
by Houshalter on Tuesday December 17, 2013 @11:14PM
(#6925855)
I didn't say property rights were part of nature, but hunger is, which is what I meant.