This is why, for the one credit card I regularly use for its cash back bonus, I have automatic weekly payments set up, each of which is far larger than the minimum would ever be. This helps guard against cases where the credit card company moves the due date around to purposefully screw a scheduled monthly payment. One has to be incredibly vigilant these days it seems.

Can the company really change the due date just like that? Sounds fscking evil! Or is that U.S. specific?

In Europe I would expect a 1-2 month notification period, or renegotiation of the credit card terms which implies the need to sign some papers to recognize the new due date (or failing/refusing that, alternatively have the card terminated).

Am I the only one here who has gotten a good ways into their adult life without ever needing a credit card?

The only time it's ever been an issue for me is renting cars; we have a corporate Amex account for that, but I haven't gotten a personal Amex.

What is the huge advantage of having a credit card? I get that regularly using one builds your credit. But that's a circular argument. The people who care about your credit the most? Credit card companies. We've bought houses twice in the last couple years, and our credit history wasn't an issue.

I'm assuming you use a debit card, because I imagine it's very difficult to live on cash only (you need something with a number to buy stuff online, for one thing.) I used to have a debit card only, but it's a bit scary: whoever steals your debit card number (or the card itself) has direct access to all money you have in your checking account. If they steal your credit card number on the other hand, then (a) they can only get up to your limit (which I keep low) and (b) you can challenge the bill and not pay and you are protected by law in some way. As long as you pay the bill in full at the end of each month, you can't lose.

Sure. I also don't live credit-free; we've used installment credit to buy an appliance or two, and of course we've made car payments. But credit cards? What's the huge win?

As for debit card loss liability: I've had cards stolen numerous times, and I've never had trouble getting charges reversed.

I have used credit cards and taken out debt before purely to game the system. (e.g. used my low interest student/bank loans as an investment source) I didn't loose money but I found there are always hidden costs and any loan creates a weight on the mind that is not healthy. I now just buy everything in cash.

My wife and I try to make as many of our purchases as possible using credit cards because we get at least 1% back in stuff. It's sad that the merchant eats at least 1.5%, but it's not my problem (although I will offer greenbacks to small business owners). We've never carried a balance, and the credit card companies haven't done much scamming for fees. I guess we're seen as more powerful than someone who needs a credit line, so they know that even a little bit of gaming will cause us to cancel the account.

Interestingly, Revolution revoked our card. I'd used it exactly once when Buy.com was offering $50 off a purchase for signing up. I guess they decided that it wasn't worth it to carry our credit line on their books (and make themselves appear to be in a more risky financial state as a result) when we weren't revenue generating.

Finance is really not that complicated. Don't borrow at even 0.001 percent unless you can invest at 0.002 percent. If you can't understand that grade of math, you're eternally doomed anyway...

Money As Debt

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2550156453790090544

It's despairing that so much of modern capitalism has moved from "a fair deal at a fair price" to a scam of sorts -- even if it's a legal scam.