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Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by chiph on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @09:24AM (#5779818)
If you're targeting a single hash

I was going to mention this. If your user record has a column called "IsSuperuser", then an attacker is going to concentrate on those users, since the reward for cracking them is so much higher. Individual salts or not, with multi-GPU based brute-forcing, they won't stand long.

Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by _b8r0 on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @10:10AM (#5780136)
Indeed, the best resource I've found for adversely affecting brute-force password cracking comes from the *coin cryptocurrencies.

GPUs allow us to generate much much longer chains in rainbow tables than before. This means that there's a re-evaluation of space trade-off based on chain length, so simple salting mechanisms (e.g. 4 char alphanumeric such as Cisco Type 5) become feasible. For now they're not incredibly practical for full mixalphanum 1-8 at 99.99% probability but it looks possible.

Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by chiph on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @10:32AM (#5780250)
Since rainbow tables are now functionally obsolete, perhaps the best use of a salt is not to add randomness, but to enforce a minimum length. So if your salt is 40 chars, even if a user puts in a one-character-long password they're still at a length of 41 and will get some protection.

Combine that with a skip + take algorithm (not just appending the salt and password together) where you interleave the salt and password, and you might have some improved defense.

Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by Coincoin on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @11:40AM (#5780647)
Nope, a salt is public. Its only purpose is to force you to brute force one hash at a time. It might also protect you against some attacks particular to your hashing algorithm.

It does not slow down the brute force itself. A lonely salted one letter password is as weak as an unsalted one.

Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by chiph on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @12:48PM (#5781068)
Given that an attacker is going to focus on high-value accounts if they can, slowing down a brute force attack on a per-hashed-value basis is pretty much your only defense. Adding complexity (like you would when defending against a rainbow table attack) adds little value when defending against a GPU-based attack that can crank out a billion hashes a minute. So what you can do is add artificial length to the password + salt combination by using a very long salt. By necessity, you'd have to use a better hashing algorithm that will have a lower chance of an attacker getting lucky with a collision, and maybe is "slower" than other hash algorithms.
Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by _b8r0 on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @02:35PM (#5781754)
Nope. The correct way to do this is to use a password based key derivation function like scrypt[1] or pbkdf2[2].

[1] - https://www.tarsnap.com/scrypt.html

[2] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PBKDF2

Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by _b8r0 on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @02:34PM (#5781746)
As long as there are unsalted hashes or hashes that use predictable salting mechanisms in use, rainbow tables are far from obselete, functionally or otherwise.
Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by smackfu on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @07:47PM (#5783631)
Or just do it based on usernames. It would be fairly easy to generate a list of high value usernames (reporters, admins, bloggers all tend to use consistent usernames), and then concentrate on those.
Re:How crackers ransack passwords like “qeadzcwrsfxv1331” by Shivetya on Tuesday May 28, 2013 @01:53PM (#5781455)
why would any portion of the record be visible to anyone who has not the security to unlock the record? As in, why should the structure be public?