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Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by mtgx on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @11:56AM (#5525904)
Can they access mail without a warrant that is older than 180 days? If not how the hell is that e-mail law constitutional?
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by rayiner on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @12:05PM (#5525976)
The EFF has a good page on the principles underlying "reasonable expectation of privacy." See: https://ssd.eff.org/your-computer/govt/privacy.

The crux of the matter is "knowing exposure to third parties." So you have an expectation of privacy in sealed postal mail, but not say post cards or anything printed on the outside of envelopes. While a postal service as a matter of course can't read what's in peoples' sealed letter mail, e-mail is sent in plain text and can be seen by any intermediary SMTP server as well as system administrators of the sending and target mail servers. That's just the nature of the protocol.

Moreover, the fact that the U.S. Postal Service is an agency of the government puts it under heightened scrutiny as compared to e-mail providers who are private parties. The fact that people would be horrified if the U.S. Postal Service were tearing open envelopes and scanning mail to send targeted catalogs, etc, to people but accept Google, etc, doing the same thing as a matter of course really cuts at the knees of the argument that people have the same "expectation of privacy" in their e-mail as they do their letter mail.

Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by disposition2 on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @01:12PM (#5526493)
So would an attachment to an email (say a zipset of text files) fall under the category of reasonable expectation of privacy?
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by __david__ on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @01:39PM (#5526692)
Is that attachment encrypted?
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by DanielBMarkham on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @12:10PM (#5526017)
But now that gmail has ssl access, this is no longer true, right?
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by rayiner on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @12:12PM (#5526037)
Gmail has SSL to Google's e-mail server. If you e.g. send a mail to someone using Outlook, it's sent in clear text. And at both ends it's scanned to deliver everyone involved targeted advertising.

"Reasonable expectation of privacy" doesn't have an implicit "only as against the government." If you're knowingly exposing the contents to Google and Microsoft to scan, you can't claim to have a "reasonable expectation of privacy" in the contents.

Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by alexanderh on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @12:56PM (#5526384)
And this is why you always use something along the lines of PGP end to end.
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by palebluedot on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @01:46PM (#5526733)
The problem is this works only with 2 parties that have already agreed to, and are willing to use, encryption. How many websites, services, and other sources of email have an option to encrypt your email to you with your public key? Not many at all.

I've stopped putting my public key on emails I send, because almost no one ever encrypted email to me, unless they were specifically sending something perceived to be sensitive.

Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by kyrias on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @03:53PM (#5527646)
Give me your key and I'll send you one ;)
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by mimiflynn on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @01:31PM (#5526620)
PGP needs to be more easily accessed by non-tech folk.
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by eksith on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @04:58PM (#5528115)
Absolutely. Some of the biggest failures in security is lack of ease of use by and large, in addition to ignorance. I think most people are willing to do the proper thing, but they'll actually do it only if it's easy.
Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by maxerickson on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @01:55PM (#5526800)
Is it reasonable to have different feelings about an automated system than some random person?

The ad-bots at Google aren't known to be very gossipy.

(I don't mean this to be snide. I think this is an instance of a very interesting phenomenon, where we reason about our society as if it were a village.)

Re:IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant by rayiner on Wednesday April 10, 2013 @02:05PM (#5526877)
The law avoids anthropomorphizing computers. So the "person" here is Google, not the ad-bots. The ad-bots are just tools used by the person who has access to your e-mail.