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Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by tcuk on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @04:47PM (#5069247)
I'd expect more intelligent people, which this community claims to consist of, to not react the way it has to the events, with nothing but hyperbole and sensationalism.

The only clear concise analysis I have seen in the myriad of submissions was an analysis by Prof Orin Kerr, which was full of comments containing more hyperbole, that disappeared to no where instantly.

Speaks volumes IMO, and it's really deterring to some of us who prefer learning and discussing the facts in a more well thought concise, clear, and logical manner.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by detst on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @04:58PM (#5069303)

  I'd expect more intelligent people, which this community
  claims to consist of, to not react the way it has to the
  events, with nothing but hyperbole and sensationalism.
Your first comment here on HN contains this:

  Even within this submission, the comments here still talk
  and insinuate Aaron was facing life imprisonment, danger to
  being raped daily, and suicide was his only option.
Talk about hyperbole and sensationalism. There's been some of that but I've seen none of those three specific statements and if that's all you've got out of these discussions, you're seriously missing something. Just because you disagree doesn't make it all "hyperbole and sensationalism".

People are emotional and justifiably angry. Maybe some of it has been a bit ridiculous but that doesn't invalidate the disgust with these events and with the larger systemic issues.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by anigbrowl on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @06:32PM (#5069777)
I saw all such specific statements yesterday, albeit from different people. In particular, the argument that he was facing life imprisonment because the maximum possible term for the offenses he was charged with totaled 35 years was widely repeated. The news media does this all the time because big numbers sound most impressive, but the maximum sentence is only sought and handed down in a small minority of criminal cases.
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by smsm42 on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @08:33PM (#5070362)
The fact that is handed down rarely does not mean it was not threatened. And the reason why it handed down rarely may very well be that others plead out, because they were scared of that maximum sentence - which was exactly the problem in this case, that he did not want to accept the plea.
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by tcuk on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:14PM (#5069370)
Honestly read the comments in the submission.. It was insane the amount of misinformation being thrown around. I'm sorry if my comment was exaggerated, I was just trying to highlight the issue.
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by codemac on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:58PM (#5069627)
Maybe the comments in the submission... were just trying to highlight the issues they saw.

Don't defend exacting discourse with the very hyperbole you claim is destroying it.

Let it be noted: I find immense irony in this discussion occurring in a thread where the parent comment is about how things need their context. What you're defining as misinformation needs to be taken in context.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by smsm42 on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @08:29PM (#5070341)
So exaggerating for you is just highlighting the issue, but exaggerating for everybody else is insane. I see how it works :)
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by ChuckMcM on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:26PM (#5069436)
The challenge is that even a community that is 99.9% rational and intelligent people, leaves hundreds, maybe even a thousand irrational and outspoken people participating.

Add to that the scourge of people who circumvent community guidance demand that their speech be heard, even when there are clear indications from the community that it is unwanted. Poses something of a challenge to the system as a whole.

Side note: Are you, tcuk, really making all of these judgements based on being a member of this community for less than 48 hours?

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by tcuk on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:42PM (#5069538)
Chuck could you provide an analysis of how this article ends up on the front page of here, specifically what value it adds to the situation and how relevant it is.

To me I'm struggling to figure out how it relates to Aaron's case , is it purposefully being obtuse? Is it not obvious to everyone who's ever read anything to do with the case that the only reason spoofing his MAC address mattered was his intent to circumvent blocks placed on his connection?

Actions by themselves are mostly meaningless it's the context and intent that matters...

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by jackpirate on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @09:26PM (#5070575)
I'd expect more intelligent people, which this community claims to consist of, to not react the way it has to the events, with nothing but hyperbole and sensationalism.

So it turns out "intelligent" people are first and foremost just people like everyone else. We need to remember our humanity and allow ourselves to be humbled by our flaws.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by lelandbatey on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:02PM (#5069314)
I agree with much that you say. Sensationalism satisfies many of our base neurological desires. Indeed, I know that I share many thoughts with "sensationalists" and I responded similarly.

I cannot make any statements of blame, since being sensationalist is to be human, as we all are. However, I'd ask that everyone please inform yourself as much as possible. The indictment is available [0]online and is well worth reading.

[0] https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/217117-united-states...

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by nitrogen on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:18PM (#5069394)
If you want sensationalism, read a federal indictment. Their job isn't to paint a fair picture of the accused; it's to make the accused sound like scum.
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by jack-r-abbit on Wednesday January 16, 2013 @05:48PM (#5069564)
Thanks for that. A good read. Assuming they had evidence to back that up (which both legal teams would have been privy to and would have been presented at trial), it seems pretty clear to me that he knew that what he was doing was not exactly above board there. I have little doubt Aaron knew what he was doing would get him in trouble if caught. Sure he probably did not expect that much trouble. We can be upset that he was possibly facing 35 (or what ever) years as that seems a bit excessive... but let's not pretend that Aaron had no clue that he was doing something he shouldn't be doing.
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by nitrogen on Thursday January 17, 2013 @01:00AM (#5071263)
There's "shouldn't be doing" as in "will get you personally banned from MIT's network with a stern talking to from the IT department," and there's "shouldn't be doing" as in "will get you 35 years in federal prison."

I'd wager Aaron expected the former, or maybe a post-it note on his laptop saying, "Please discontinue what you are doing; call xxx-yyy-zzzz with any questions."

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by jack-r-abbit on Thursday January 17, 2013 @11:55AM (#5073601)
It doesn't really matter what he was expecting. If he knew he shouldn't do it then he should not have done it. And unless he had been living under a rock for the past decade, he should have expected a bit more than MIT leaving a post-it on his laptop asking him to stop. Come on... we all know that these types of actions have become more common and more public and therefore more heavily litigated. For him to expect anything less than police and lawyers would have been really naive boarding on stupid.
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by nitrogen on Thursday January 17, 2013 @03:06PM (#5074872)
There are lots of things that people "shouldn't" do, like jump off of cliffs, jump out of airplanes, follow traffic even if traffic is going 75, yet people make the judgment that doing is better than not doing. In all of your "make stuff, do stuff, buy stuff, destroy stuff," life, have you never once colored outside the lines to accomplish some greater good?

There appears to be a vast cultural disconnect between those who recognize the nobility of Aaron's effectively harmless stunts, and those who take a hardline stance in defense of the status quo.

It is my sincere opinion that any sort of prison time should require genuine criminal intent (that is, the intent to do serious harm), that the judicial system should focus on prevention and rehabilitation, not punishment or deterrence, and that sacrificing the odd "example" here or there is an unacceptable infringement of the rights of the one who is made an example.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by jack-r-abbit on Thursday January 17, 2013 @05:40PM (#5075712)
I have colored outside the lines plenty of times... both good and bad. And when it got me in trouble (which is has), I took my punishment. The people doing the act and the people standing on the sidelines and those that benefit from the act can think the act is "effectively harmless" or that there was no intent to do "serious harm" all they want. But there is always someone on the other end of it. Aaron's actions (and the efforts to stop/prevent them) caused servers to go down & legit access to be cut off. That caused harm to others. Maybe that isn't the same definition of "harm" that you use but you don't get to dictate what others feel is harmful or not any more than I do.

Whether it is cultural or whatever, I don't think what he did was noble at all. And hardly a stunt. He started downloading for free all the documents that were otherwise behind a pay-for-access service that placed limits on what a person could get at. He used various methods to circumvent attempts to prevent him from doing it. He took measures to conceal his activity. Those seem to be the facts that no one disagrees about. This has little to do with defending the status quo.

But we can agree here. It is also my opinion that Aaron should not have been facing prison time. We have prisons overflowing with bad people that have caused far greater chaos and pain than Aaron. Aaron probably should have had a lengthy house arrest and a hefty fine. Maybe restricted use of computers, etc. And that very well might have been what he would have ended up with if he'd stuck it out.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by nitrogen on Thursday January 17, 2013 @10:03PM (#5076824)
I'll restate some of the items from your second paragraph in a way that emphasizes why I think Aaron's Guerilla[sic] Open Access[0] concept is a noble one.

He started downloading for free all the documents that were otherwise behind a pay-for-access service that placed limits on what a person could get at.

He saw that scientific research, much of which was paid for by taxes (i.e. the people), was held hostage behind a paywall and wanted to provide that information to a deserving audience.

He used various methods to circumvent attempts to prevent him from doing it.

He encountered a bug in a computer system and created a workaround.

He took measures to conceal his activity.

He behaved like many of the students on any college campus would when preparing a harmless prank or exploring a steam tunnel, and perhaps didn't want his laptop stolen.

But we can agree here. It is also my opinion that Aaron should not have been facing prison time. We have prisons overflowing with bad people that have caused far greater chaos and pain than Aaron. Aaron probably should have had a lengthy house arrest and a hefty fine. Maybe restricted use of computers, etc. And that very well might have been what he would have ended up with if he'd stuck it out.

Much of my vehemence in these discussions of the last week stems from the sheer magnitude of the onslaught that is standard practice for prosecutors. If the law and its enforcers were more reasonable in this case, I'd find it much easier to be reasonable in response. Instead, prosecutors seem to see fit to alienate a huge chunk of the population, spreading disrespect for the law (and, I guess, giving them more defendants to prosecute in the future).

I'd be perfectly happy myself, if I were Aaron, to publicly apologize, do some community service, and go on my way never to interact with JSTOR or MIT again, as this prevents the alleged harm that would have come to JSTOR with the minimum necessary imposition from the law. But I would not be happy about being bullied by prosecutors. I don't even see why house arrest should be "lengthy," or a fine "hefty," because in reality his actions had a minimal effect on MIT or JSTOR (bandwidth is cheap).

[0]http://pastebin.com/cefxMVAy

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by jack-r-abbit on Friday January 18, 2013 @10:35AM (#5079106)
I respect your opinion but do not agree.

He saw that scientific research.... Not his call to make, really.

He encountered a bug..... Not sure I agree that attempts to block his access was a "bug" that needed a workaround.

Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by nitrogen on Friday January 18, 2013 @03:46PM (#5080906)
Someone had to do something to upset the status quo of paywalls and ignorance because it certainly wasn't going to happen from within the publishers. Increased scientific literacy and better science reporting due to the availability of the entire paper (and all the other papers that support or refute it) instead of a press release are greater goods than profit for Elsevier (which wouldn't be significantly affected by releasing historic papers anyway).
Re:I conceal my identity the same way Aaron was indicted for by halfninety on Thursday January 17, 2013 @03:01AM (#5071594)
I can't stand the mob, sometimes I feel that they are insulting my intelligence. But no revolution is possible without them. When intelligent people come together and try to make a deal, that's called dirty politics.