News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by acdha on Friday November 30, 2012 @08:10AM (#4853033)
Your point could have done without the [casual?] [unintended?] sexism: “mom” is not synonymous with “technically unskilled”.
Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by obstacle1 on Friday November 30, 2012 @08:34AM (#4853121)
The only sexism evident here is your own. Why did you assume that "mom" is the dominant descriptor in the term "mommy blogger" rather than "blogger" or the whole term? Why did you jump on the chance to cry sexism without knowing the definition of the term you were taking issue with? "Mommy blogger" is a term with a specific meaning, not just a synonym for mother.

It seems that the language police have been ramping up their efforts recently on HN. That is extremely unfortunate. Reading comments would be a much better experience if the pseudo-causeheads would at least attempt a rational discourse.

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by zalew on Friday November 30, 2012 @08:43AM (#4853156)
I once said something about teenage coders and someone raised the ageism banner. Political correctness is getting natzee in here sometimes, like we got binders full of women or sth.
Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by acdha on Saturday December 01, 2012 @03:33PM (#4858880)
> Why did you assume that "mom" is the dominant descriptor in the term "mommy blogger" rather than "blogger" or the whole term?

If he'd meant "blogger" generically he could simply have used the word unmodified. Instead, he specialized it by using a gendered term to repeat a common stereotype about a broad class of people. Have you ever heard anyone use a neutral or male identified term in a context like this? Would the point have any way been worse as “No sports-blogger“ or “No photo-blogger”?

As for your attempt to claim that this is somehow due to my not knowing the definition of the term, I would note that your choice to resort to personal attacks rather comically undercuts your proclaimed desire for “rational discourse”.

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by obstacle1 on Tuesday December 04, 2012 @12:49AM (#4869720)
>Have you ever heard anyone use a neutral or male identified term in a context like this?

How about "brogrammer"?

>your choice to resort to personal attacks rather comically undercuts your proclaimed desire for “rational discourse”.

It's actually not ad hominem, since I'm using your own words against you. What you typed betrays latent sexism. I'm not just calling you a sexist without evidence.

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by zalew on Friday November 30, 2012 @08:16AM (#4853048)
Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by pretoriusB on Friday November 30, 2012 @08:52AM (#4853192)
And he could have done with less unprovoked politically correct corrections on HN, especially when they are factually false. A programmer's mom may not be synonymous with "technically unskilled", but statistically speaking, the overwhelming majority of them are. Should we pretend that this is not the case in order to satisfy some "non sexism" criterion?

Not to mention that HN's readership is not just US based. It is cultural imperialism to enforce US-centric PC notions on a international platform. At the least, it is provincialism.

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by acdha on Saturday December 01, 2012 @03:43PM (#4858905)
> And he could have done with less unprovoked politically correct corrections on HN, especially when they are factually false. A programmer's mom may not be synonymous with "technically unskilled", but statistically speaking, the overwhelming majority of them are

So are the overwhelming majority of many other types of bloggers - in fact, the unmodified term “blogger” would have carried the meaning equally well. The choice to specialize the term in a highly-gendered manner is unnecessary, particularly when it reinforces common stereotypes and using it adds nothing to the actual point being made. That's why I suggested this was not deliberate: it's so common in mainstream society that many people aren't even consciously using it.

As for your “cultural imperialism“, “provincialism”, those terms have specific meanings which aren't relevant - they are not simply free passes for you not to have to think about topics which make you uncomfortable.

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by pretoriusB on Sunday December 02, 2012 @07:05AM (#4860963)
>The choice to specialize the term in a highly-gendered manner is unnecessary, particularly when it reinforces common stereotypes and using it adds nothing to the actual point being made.

It does: it presents the point in a well understood idiom, something people can easily relate to, not to mention being statistically correct. It also avoids him self-censoring his speech because of what some vocal over-tight prudes might think. The republican right does enough censorship --there's no need for a progressive censorship to pile up on it.

>As for your “cultural imperialism“, “provincialism”, those terms have specific meanings which aren't relevant - they are not simply free passes for you not to have to think about topics which make you uncomfortable.

No, they are perfectly relevant here. You come here thinking that your little PC diatribe applies the world over. It is not.

There are cultures in perfectly modern western societies that view those PC notions with ridicule (of which "So he said mom to imply non-tech-savvy-person? Big f'n deal" is the more polite version), if not frown upon them. Not everyone shares the very protestant hypocrisy of covering their past crimes (e.g racism, sexism) with current guilt.

To project that PC ideology (and to ask to enforce it) to the international HN audience is the very core of provincialism, in the sesse of the George Bernard Shaw quote: "[H]e is a barbarian, and thinks that the customs of his tribe and island are the laws of nature".

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by acdha on Sunday December 02, 2012 @12:08PM (#4861750)
You keep misusing the term censorship: asking someone to reconsider their choice of words is not the same as saying that they should not be allowed to say it. Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

I find amusing that you ended it with a quote which more accurately describes your own actions. I hold no illusion that cultures vary or that equality is far from a law of nature – that was rather the point in asking someone to consider how unconscious statements might sound to other people.

Re:Why Django and Rails CMS Are So Rare by pretoriusB on Tuesday December 04, 2012 @10:49AM (#4871421)
>You keep misusing the term censorship: asking someone to reconsider their choice of words is not the same as saying that they should not be allowed to say it.

No, but it's close enough for our purposes. They main difference is that you have not the power to forbid them. If you had, you might have gone the full way. There are, after all, many politically correct prohibitions in place in a few western cultures that made it into law.

>Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

Criticism of the other's _way of speaking_, instead of criticism of their ideas, borders, as I say above, with censorship.

>I find amusing that you ended it with a quote which more accurately describes your own actions. I hold no illusion that cultures vary or that equality is far from a law of nature

Yes, but apparently you still hold the illusion that your (culture's) way is the one that has achieved the more equality, and that the method your culture has chosen to deal with equality is the correct one.

Which is kind of amusing from a culture with, say, an embarrassingly disproportionate percentage of their black population in jail.