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A comment on Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fire truck on runway. Parent comment

Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by estearum on Monday March 23, 2026 @06:03PM (#47495746)
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47492768

Can you please explain how specifically you imagine a scenario like this getting automated?

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by CamperBob2 on Monday March 23, 2026 @06:27PM (#47495993)
No, that's not how this works. You tell me why it can't or shouldn't be automated.

"Design an automated ATC system" isn't a valid answer to "Why can't ATC be automated?"

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by wk_end on Monday March 23, 2026 @07:23PM (#47496492)
Er, I sort of do think that's how it works? The ultimate rebuttal to "you can't do X" is to actually do X. Until you do that I think that ultimately the burden of proof falls on you. It can be very easy to imagine certain tasks and systems can be automated - especially when you aren't actively involved in those tasks and systems and are unfamiliar with their intricacies.
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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by estearum on Monday March 23, 2026 @07:29PM (#47496548)
You: why don't we have a universal cancer vaccine?

Me: [ insert specific example of currently intractable problem ]

You: sounds like an excuse

Me: okay... can you explain how it could work?

You: THAT'S NOT HOW THIS WORKS

okay

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by CamperBob2 on Monday March 23, 2026 @08:42PM (#47497263)
More like:

Me: Why don't we use radiation to treat cancer?

You: Radiation is dangerous

Me: Sounds like an excuse

You: OK, design a medical-grade synchrotron

Me: That's not how this works

You: LOL pwned

...insert specific example of currently intractable problem...

What makes the problem intractable? We can now do both voice recognition and synthesis at human levels, and any video game programmer from the 1980s can keep some objects from running into each other.

When an emergency is declared, keep the other objects in a holding pattern and give the affected object permission to land. Then roll the fire trucks. Preferably not routing both the trucks and another aircraft onto the same runway, as the humans apparently did here.

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by dpark on Monday March 23, 2026 @10:58PM (#47498172)
It’s not weird that you believe automated ATC is possible. The weird thing is that you insist it’s simple.

People’s lives hang in the balance of a system built of corner cases. And you trot out radiation treatment as your metaphor? As if we didn’t royally fuck that up and kill a bunch of people at first.

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by CamperBob2 on Tuesday March 24, 2026 @12:04AM (#47498478)
The 'simple' remark was in response to your wide-eyed implication that 1000 takeoffs and landings per day is somehow a challenge for modern computing systems.

You'll lose this argument sooner or later. I just hope it happens before several hundred people find out the hard way that humans no longer have any business in a control tower. With your attitude, Therac-25 would have been seen as grounds to shut down the entire field of radiotherapy.

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by dpark on Tuesday March 24, 2026 @01:26AM (#47498896)
Your “simple” springs from your assumption that the problem is easy and anyone who disagrees is dumb. This is also why you can’t hear any of the answers others have given you. You don’t want answers. You want to be “right”.

No one thinks that the difficulty with automatic ATC is that computers have trouble counting 1000 things.

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by CamperBob2 on Tuesday March 24, 2026 @03:12AM (#47499466)
No one thinks that the difficulty with automatic ATC is that computers have trouble counting 1000 things.

I mean, you're the one who said it...

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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by estearum on Tuesday March 24, 2026 @07:33AM (#47501160)
One approach that has always served me well in life is when someone appears to say something that seems obviously not true (like that computers can't count to 1000), consider whether I actually have misunderstood them.
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Re:Jazz CRJ9 at New York on Mar 22nd 2026, collision with fi... by estearum on Monday March 23, 2026 @09:10PM (#47497433)
> What makes the problem intractable? We can now do both voice recognition and synthesis at human levels, and any video game programmer from the 1980s can keep some objects from running into each other.

Great point!

It must be that despite the reliability, obvious advantages, and accessibility to "any video game programmer from the 1980s", everyone else is just choosing not to do it.

Alternatively, these things are not as simple or as reliable as you, a person who has no familiarity with the problem, assumes them to be.

I guess we'll never know ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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