Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by zevets on Saturday September 13, 2025 @04:39PM
(#45235135)
Please do this.
But first: we need to take step-zero and introduce a type "r64": a "f64" that is not nan/inf.
Rust has its uint-thats-not-zero - why not the same for floating point numbers??
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by 1718627440 on Saturday September 13, 2025 @05:37PM
(#45235538)
> Rust has its uint-thats-not-zero
Why do we need to single out a specific value. It would be way better if we also could use uint-without-5-and-42. What I would wish for is type attributes that really belong to the type.
typedef unsigned int __attribute__ ((constraint (X != 5 && X != 42))) my_type;
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by steveklabnik on Saturday September 13, 2025 @05:50PM
(#45235623)
Those are the unstable attributes that your sibling is talking about.
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by 1718627440 on Saturday September 13, 2025 @06:05PM
(#45235695)
Yeah of course I can put what I want in my toy compiler. My statement was about standard C. I think that's what Contracts really are and hope this will be included in C.
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by steveklabnik on Saturday September 13, 2025 @07:31PM
(#45236164)
Oh sure, I wouldn’t call rustc a “toy compiler” but yeah, they’d be cool in C as well.
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by int_19h on Sunday September 14, 2025 @12:41AM
(#45237493)
Proper union types would get you there. If you have them, then each specific integer constant is basically its own type, and e.g. uint8 is just (0|1|2|...|255). So long as your type algebra has an operator that excludes one of the variants from the union to produce a new one, it's trivial to exclude whatever, and it's still easy for the compiler to reason about such types and to provide syntactic sugar for them like 0..255 etc.
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by tialaramex on Saturday September 13, 2025 @05:03PM
(#45235284)
You can write your "r64" type today. You would need a perma-unstable compiler-only feature to give your type a huge niche where the missing bit patterns would go, but otherwise there's no problem that I can see, so if you don't care about the niche it's just another crate - there is something similar called noisy_float
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by zevets on Saturday September 13, 2025 @06:07PM
(#45235717)
I can do it, and I do similar such things in C++ - but the biggest benefit of "safe defaults" is the standardization of such behaviors, and the resultant expectations/ecosystem.
Re:Safe C++ proposal is not being continued
by Yoric on Sunday September 14, 2025 @12:44PM
(#45241230)
Dependent types in well-behaved, well-defined snippets of C++ dedicated to numeric kernels?
While I think it's a great idea, this also sounds like it would require fairly major rewrites (and possibly specialized libraries?), which suggests that it would be hard to get much buy-in.
Have you worked much with SAL and MIDL from Microsoft? Using SAL (an aesthetically hideous but conceptually beautiful macro based gradual typing system for C and C++) overlay guarantees about not only reference safety but also sign comparison restriction, maximum buffer sizes, and so on.