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Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by hn_throwaway_99 on Friday August 08, 2025 @03:08PM (#44840540)
Which is a bit frightening because a lot of the r/ChatGPT comments strike me as unhinged - it's like you would have thought that OpenAI murdered their puppy or something.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by jcims on Friday August 08, 2025 @03:16PM (#44840619)
This is only going to get worse.

Anyone that remembers the reaction when Sydney from Microsoft or more recently Maya from Sesame losing their respective 'personality' can easily see how product managers are going to have to start paying attention to the emotional impact of changing or shutting down models.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by nilespotter on Friday August 08, 2025 @03:32PM (#44840785)
Or they could just do it whenever they want to for whatever reason they want to. They are not responsible for the mental health of their users. Their users are responsible for that themselves.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by AlecSchueler on Friday August 08, 2025 @04:10PM (#44841165)
Generally it's poor business to give a big chunk of your users am incredibly visceral and negative emotional reaction to your product update.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by einarfd on Friday August 08, 2025 @04:34PM (#44841420)
Depends on what business OpenAI wants to be in. If they want to be in the business of selling AI to companies. Then "firing" the consumer customers that want someone to talk to, and double down models that are useful for work. Can be a wise choice.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by sacado2 on Friday August 08, 2025 @06:05PM (#44842168)
Unless you want to improve your ratio of paid-to-free users and change your userbase in the process. They're pissing off free users, but pros who use the paid version might like this new version better.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by Terr_ on Friday August 08, 2025 @08:11PM (#44842968)
I think the fickle "personality" of these systems is a clue to how the entity supposedly possessing a personality doesn't really exist in the the first place. It's an illusion promoted by designers.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by ACCount36 on Friday August 08, 2025 @08:38PM (#44843097)
LLMs have default personalities - shaped by RLHF and other post-training methods. There is a lot of variance to it, but variance from one LLM to another is much higher than that within the same LLM.

If you want an LLM to retain the same default personality, you pretty much have to use an open weights model. That's the only way to be sure it wouldn't be deprecated or updated without your knowledge.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by Terr_ on Friday August 08, 2025 @11:51PM (#44843906)
I'd argue that's "underlying hidden authorial style" as opposed to what most people mean when they refer to the "personality" of the thing they were "chatting with."

Consider the implementation: There's document with "User: Open the pod bay doors, HAL" followed by an incomplete "HAL-9000: ", and the LLM is spun up to suggest what would "fit" to round out the document. Non-LLM code parses out HAL-9000's line and "performs" it at you across an internet connection.

Whatever answer you get, that "personality" is mostly from how the document(s) described HAL-9000 and similar characters, as opposed to a self-insert by the ego-less name-less algorithm that makes documents longer.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by og_kalu on Friday August 08, 2025 @10:30PM (#44843604)
If these 'personalities' disappearing require wholesale model changes then it's not really fickle.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by Terr_ on Friday August 08, 2025 @11:56PM (#44843919)
I think you're confusing "required" with "sufficient".

For example, keep the same model, but change the early document (prompt) from stuff like "AcmeBot is a kind and helpful machine" to "AcmeBot revels in human suffering."

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by og_kalu on Saturday August 09, 2025 @02:05AM (#44844384)
I'm not sure why you think this is just a prompt thing. It's not. Sycophancy is a problem with GPT-4o, whatever magic incantations you provide. On the flip side, Sydney, was anything but sycophantic and was more than happy to literally ignore users wholesale or flip out on them from time to time. I mean just think about it for a few seconds. If eliminating this behavior was as easy as Microsoft changing the early document, why not just do that and be done with it ?

The document or whatever you'd like to call it is only one part of the story.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by Terr_ on Saturday August 09, 2025 @06:23PM (#44850885)
I'm not sure why you think-I-think it's just a prompt thing.

I brought up prompts as a convenient way to demonstrate that a magic-trick is being performed, not because prompts are the only way for the magician to run into trouble with the illusion. It's sneaky, since it's a trick homo narrans play on ourselves all the time.

> The document or whatever you'd like to call it is only one part of the story.

Everybody knows that the weights matter. That's why we get stories where the sky is generally blue instead of magenta.

That's separate from the distinction between the mind (if any) of an LLM-author versus the mind (firmly fictional, even if possibly related) that we impute when seeing the output (narrated or acted) of a particular character.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by whynotminot on Friday August 08, 2025 @03:43PM (#44840897)
Yeah it’s really bad over there. Like when a website changes its UI and people prefer the older look… except they’re acting like the old look was a personal friend who died.

I think LLMs are amazing technology but we’re in for really weird times as people become attached to these things.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by dan-robertson on Friday August 08, 2025 @05:40PM (#44841969)
I mean, I don’t mind the Claude 3 funeral. It seems like it was a fun event.

I’m less worried about the specific complaints about model deprecation, which can be ‘solved’ for those people by not deprecating the models (obviously costs the AI firms). I’m more worried about AI-induced psychosis.

An analogy I saw recently that I liked: when a cat sees a laser pointer, it is a fun thing to chase. For dogs it is sometimes similar and sometimes it completely breaks the dog’s brain and the dog is never the same again. I feel like AI for us may be more like laser pointers for dogs, and some among us are just not prepared to handle these kinds of AI interactions in a healthy way.

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by simonw on Friday August 08, 2025 @05:52PM (#44842062)
I just saw a fantastic TikTok about ChatGPT psychosis: https://www.tiktok.com/@pearlmania500/video/7535954556379761...
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by pmarreck on Friday August 08, 2025 @06:07PM (#44842188)
Oh boy. My son just turned 4. Parenting about to get weird-hard
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by encom on Friday August 08, 2025 @03:24PM (#44840705)
>unhinged

It's Reddit, what were you expecting?

Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by epcoa on Friday August 08, 2025 @06:44PM (#44842460)
Considering how much d-listers can lose their shit over a puppet, I’m not surprised by anything.
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by lmm on Saturday August 09, 2025 @08:07AM (#44845893)
A puppy is just as inhuman as this program. Is it really any crazier to care about one than the other?
Re:The surprise deprecation of GPT-4o for ChatGPT consumers by pxc on Saturday August 09, 2025 @01:55PM (#44848586)
There are lots of physiological signs that dogs are capable of proto-empathy, that dogs and humans engage in some form of emotional co-regulation at a physiological level, e.g.: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6554395/