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Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by jswny on Monday July 21, 2025 @08:26PM (#44641991)
What are the soft real time limitations of erlang?
Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by im_down_w_otp on Monday July 21, 2025 @08:49PM (#44642135)
Erlang's BEAM, assuming no chicanery of NIFs, will use reduction counting to eventually yield a scheduler to make sure other Erlang processes get execution time. This gives you kind of a "will eventually happen" property. It can't guarantee meeting a deadline. Just that all things will be serviced at some point.
Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by elcritch on Monday July 21, 2025 @10:31PM (#44642693)
Right GRiSP has support for creating RTOS tasks in C, IIRC.

Within BEAM itself there’s no priority mechanism, however, on a RPi3 or BeagleBone you could get about an 200 uS average response time to GPIO on Linux, even under moderate load. The jitter was pretty low too, like 10-20 uS on average, but the 99.9% tail latencies could get up to hundreds of millis.

That’s fine for many use cases. Still I now prefer programming on esp32’s with Nim for anything realtime. Imperative programming just makes handling arrays easier. Just wish FreeRTOS tasks had error handling akin to OTP supervisors.

Now Beam/Elixir would be amazing for something like HomeAssistant or large networked control systems.

Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by harrisi on Monday July 21, 2025 @11:15PM (#44642906)
Erlang does have a mechanism to modify process priority, with process_flag/2,3.

As of OTP 28 there's also priority messaging that a process can opt in to. Not really related, but it's new and interesting to note.

Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by jacquesm on Tuesday July 22, 2025 @10:19AM (#44647224)
> As of OTP 28 there's also priority messaging that a process can opt in to.

That's a very important feature. Without priority messaging you can't nicely recover from queues that start backing up.

Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by actionfromafar on Tuesday July 22, 2025 @06:32AM (#44645246)
Just a reminder that commonly "real-time" on stuff like VxWorks isn't hard realtime either. You test a bunch of scenarios, put in some execution CPU head-room you are comfortable with, and call it a day. With enough head-room and some more (or less, if you have money and time) hand-waving, you can more or less guarantee that deadlines will be kept.
Re:Erlang 28 on GRiSP Nano using only 16 MB by peerst on Tuesday July 22, 2025 @09:31AM (#44646660)
It's all relative. Hard Realtime vs Soft Realtime is not clearly delineated. Because on anything real world there is always a probability distribution for every deadline.

Our observation is that Erlang's "soft-realtime" is already getting much harder once Linux stays out of the way. We have a master thesis worth of research on having multiple sets of schedulers in one Erlang VM that run on different hard real-time priorities plus research on a network of message passing and garbage collecting Erlang processes can be doing Earlies Deadline First scheduling.

However that stayed prototypical because we found relativeness of vanilla Erlang on RTEMS was good enough for all practical customer problems we solved.

For very high performance hard real-time we drop down to C and we are currently working on a little language that can be programmed from the Erlang level that avoids that.