Well, my claim was fairly specific, so it's quite easy.

There are ~42k traffic fatalities in the US each year. Cameras-only self driving cars are a tiny fraction of the number of total cars.

The highest estimates I've seen for annual traffic deaths with an ADAS involved (not even implying causation) is in the range of dozens. Cameras-only self driving cars would be a fraction of those. As a result, there are quite possibly more than a thousand traffic fatalities each year caused by human-driven cars for each ONE caused by a cameras-only self driving car.

But my original claim was only that they kill a lot fewer. That seems self-evident.

you are either on spectrum ( i like frontier more ) or you used ai to generate that response...

I didn't use AI, so I guess I learned something about myself today.

Please don't do this here. If a comment seems unfit for HN, please flag it and email us at [email protected] so we can have a look.

That's cute, and also totally irrelevant. Nobody cares about absolute numbers, the thing to care about is the rate. Pick your denominator, but I like deaths per million miles.

Polonium ingestion also kills fewer people than self driving cars, so by that token, polonium ingestion is perfectly safe.

The claim was the claim. If you want to discuss numbers that neither of us have sources for, it'll have to be with someone else.

Meanwhile, there are ~42k traffic deaths per year that could be prevented by focusing on human-driven cars.

> Meanwhile, there are ~42k traffic deaths per year that could be prevented by focusing on human-driven cars

Eh, there are over a hundred thousands deaths attributable to Musk's actions in the White House [1]. I agree with you on the short-term calculus. But trusting Tesla to help reduce those traffic deaths--and furthermore, enabling its position of power--puts those states' sovereignty in jeopardy. Swapping lives for sovereignty is an old (and trusted) trade.

[1] https://www.bu.edu/sph/news/articles/2025/tracking-anticipat...