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Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by bryanlarsen on Friday April 25, 2025 @04:07PM (#43798021)
The rebate can be paid out more frequently than annually.
Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by kjreact on Friday April 25, 2025 @05:14PM (#43798584)
Having a carbon tax seems to be the most fair way to combat climate change; unfortunately in practice it is political suicide. Australia had a carbon tax in 2011 and was quickly repealed in 2014. Likewise Canada also implemented such a tax in 2019 and was repealed this year prior to their election. People like to say that they want to help the environment, but when it comes time to vote they vote against such policies.
Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by xyzzy123 on Friday April 25, 2025 @08:14PM (#43799737)
The Australian implementation had a lot of problems. Instead of being a tax applied to say, coal, oil & gas it was a scheme that applied to the 500 largest emitters. These emitters then (crucially) estimated their own emissions minus offsets and paid tax on that.

The issue with this is that it creates a whole parallel (and largely fake) carbon accounting world. Fake estimates, fake offsets - but real public money.

Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by bryanlarsen on Monday April 28, 2025 @11:23AM (#43822498)
Yes, carbon taxes are tricky, with loopholes and grifters etc.

But it's still substantially simpler, with fewer loopholes and grifters than any of the effective alternatives proposed.

Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by Teever on Friday April 25, 2025 @05:57PM (#43798912)
Canada ultimately repealed the carbon tax because it was used as a political cudgel against the Liberal party that enacted it by the Conservative opposition in a sustained fashion for several years.

Which is dismaying because carbon taxes are a conservative solution to this problem and IIRC the first political entities to suggest the implementation of them in Canada were Conservative.

At the end of the day you have a nontrivial amount of the population, and many in positions of power who just outright deny environmental concerns and climate change as an existential threat.

They aren't going to approach this problem in good faith and it isn't obvious what the solution to their nefarious influence on policy should be.

Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by bryanlarsen on Friday April 25, 2025 @07:09PM (#43799334)
Canada's implementation had two problems:

1. The textbook implementation involves 3 parts: tax, rebate and tariff. Canada only did the first 2. They were in talks with Germany/EU to create a carbon tariff zone, but that never happens. Without the tariff the carbon tax is massively unfair to local producers.

2. The rebates were almost invisible. If they would have been cheques in the mail it would have had much more impact psychologically.

But I agree, the main problem was denialism and its use as a political cudgel. It should be hard to argue that carbon tax is stealing money when all of it is given back, but they successfully did that.

Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by david-gpu on Friday April 25, 2025 @09:47PM (#43800189)
Broadly agreed. IMO the Canadian carbon tax had a marketing problem. It should have been called a Carbon Dividend. First, it would have replaced the negative connotation of the word "tax" with the positive connotation of the word "dividend -- and it would have been more accurate to how the program actually worked.

Second, and probably more important: the rebates showed up in your bank account with a description that didn't make the source obvious enough for laypeople. Had people seen monthly "CARBON DIVIDEND" credits in their bank accounts, they would have noticed.

Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by shawnz on Saturday April 26, 2025 @12:10AM (#43800872)
In official communications it was called the Canada Carbon Rebate or previously the Climate Action Incentive
Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by david-gpu on Sunday April 27, 2025 @04:56PM (#43815073)
Both of which were terrible marketing wise.
Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by shawnz on Monday April 28, 2025 @02:40PM (#43824558)
What makes "rebate" terrible but "dividend" good? They accomplish the same thing in my mind. In fact I think calling it a "dividend" would be a pretty unconventional and contrived usage of that word.
Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by david-gpu on Tuesday April 29, 2025 @07:28AM (#43831098)
Rebate: focuses attention on the tax. Dividend: focuses attention on the income people receive.

Never heard of the Alaska Permanent Fund Dividend? Except that one enshrines CO2 emissions instead of curbing them.

Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by smnrchrds on Saturday April 26, 2025 @01:35AM (#43801192)
It was never called carbon tax, but carbon pricing. It being knows as carbon tax was the result of of opposition efforts. The same efforts and results would have happened had it been called dividend or anything else.
Re:The $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no ... by AntiEgo on Monday April 28, 2025 @12:44PM (#43823398)
The feds had it labeled, "Canada Carbon Rebate", and to even get that they had to fight the banks.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/carbon-pricing-rebates-land...