News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Thursday March 06, 2025 @05:14AM (#43278426)
Turkey took millions of Syrian refugees, Germany in particular and a lot of european countries accepted many more from all over the middle east.

Food for thought why Egypt and Jordan refuse to ease the sufferring of Gazans by offering them temporary refugee statuses, until Hamas is eradicated and they could live in Gaza happily ever after.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by nix-zarathustra on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:12AM (#43278801)
> Food for thought why Egypt and Jordan refuse to ease the sufferring of Gazans by offering them temporary refugee statuses, until Hamas is eradicated and they could live in Gaza happily ever after.

Historically, Palestinians have destablized those countries. Palestinians assassinated the King of Jordan[1] and a Prime Minister[2]. Not to mention the instability in Lebanon from Palestinian migrants [3]. Eventually Jordan had to expel the Palestinians from Jordan. [4]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdullah_I_of_Jordan#Assassina...

[2]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Wasfi_Tal

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanese_Civil_War

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_September

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:05AM (#43281048)
Palestinians would be in Palestine if they weren't being ethnically cleansed by the Zionists. Any destabilization rests firmly at the feet of Zionism.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by sickofparadox on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:24AM (#43281286)
Being displaced from your home country does not give you moral shielding for killing the leaders of another. In fact, I would argue that being displaced from your home means you owe a debt of gratitude to the countries that take you in, which makes bad behavior in them more often reprehensible.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:50AM (#43281577)
You're doing a lot of work to avoid placing the blame where it belongs: Zionism.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by sickofparadox on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:57PM (#43286261)
If something terrible happens to you in your life, you don't get to just take it out on random people. That goes doubly for those reaching a hand out in assistance.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Friday March 07, 2025 @09:54AM (#43290660)
Yet that's exactly what Zionists did to Palestine.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by koutetsu on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:18AM (#43278850)
Having talked to a few Palestinias that live outside of Palestine, I know that they all have temporary statuses in the neighoboring countries (for example, those in Lebanon) and that doesn't give them much rights and it has lasted for decades already. Forcing the remaining people in Gaza to leave "temporarily" is first of all ethnic cleansing (forced displacement) and second of all it will be anything but temporary.

The same for Syrians in Turkey, they don't have a proper refugee status and have instead a secondary status that gives them fewer rights.

Here's some food for thought from me as well: why does anything that goes in and out of Gaza go through israel? Why don't other countries recognize the state of Palestine? Wouldn't that be a good step towards a two-state solution? (Even though I don't believe that would work, at least not without justice for the Palestinians).

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:27AM (#43278906)
Historically, Palestinians rejected all compromise attempts to end the conflict and get their state. that's the only reason why there's no palestinian country.

There's a great project led by a youtuber called Corey Gil-Shuster. This guy walks around the west bank and ask random people about the conflict. I think it sums up a lot of the public opinion in the palestinian territories about the conflict. Here is an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbPK7NnPRUk&ab_channel=Corey...

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by beardyw on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:18AM (#43279849)
> Historically, Palestinians rejected all compromise attempts to end the conflict and get their state

.... back.

Rather a short reading of history.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by actionfromafar on Thursday March 06, 2025 @07:43AM (#43279584)
Another big turning point was when Yitzhak Rabin was murdered. (By an israeli right-winger.)

History could have tipped entirely differently had Yitzhak lived.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yitzhak_Rabin

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by xg15 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:23AM (#43279905)
I can understand that historical position. If someone knocked on my door and told me "hey, I'm gonna take 2/3 of your house or all of it, what do you prefer?" I probably wouldn't inclined to answer either.

Of course none of the present-day Israelis are responsible for that. They are responsible for retreating into a sanitized, mythological narrative about the founding of their state, however.

> Historically, Palestinians rejected all compromise attempts to end the conflict and get their state. that's the only reason why there's no palestinian country.

Since then, Palestinians have already twice declared their acceptance of a two-state solution in the 1976 borders and declared a state in those borders. It does not explain why Israel and the US kept blocking a state even within those borders. (Meanwhile you can read in Likud's founding charter that the party always fundamentally rejected any kind of Palestinian state as their official policy - a policy that Israel now enacts increasingly openly)

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Thursday March 06, 2025 @01:24PM (#43283361)
Zionism started back in the 19th century (circa 1882), back then the land was under Ottoman rule and jews that immigrated to Israel lived on lands purchased from their rightful owners (usually Ottoman).

The palestinians who lived in what is Israel today were considered Ottoman, the term "Palestinian" was simply used to name people who live in that strip of land, rather than an actual nationality. Jews who immigrated to Israel from Europe became "Palestinians".

After the palestinians rejected the partition plan, and war broke out - they lost many of their villages. People who fled later claimed they were expelled for various reasons. Arabs who stayed put and didn't flee became full citizens

That's the whole story

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by xg15 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @02:06PM (#43283938)
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by xg15 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @03:06PM (#43284567)
1967 borders*
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by koutetsu on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:56AM (#43280219)
They have the right to reject any unfair division of the land or agreement. Why would they be the only ones to compromise whereas Israel gets to keep almost all of the land.

What did Israel compromise on? They have settler colonies in the west bank, they control everything that goes in and out of Gaza, they built a wall around Gaza, etc.

It all starts from the initial division of the land that led to the creation of Israel. To me that division makes no sense because the area is not proportial to the population and because of the very nature of the split it created. Instead of offering Palestinians a contiguous division of land, it offered them two disconnected pieces of land with Israel right in the middle. That makes no sense.

As for your video, I don't know what you're trying to stay or do by sharing it. No matter whether you like Pelstinians or not, they have rights especially so under apartheid, settler colonialism and genocide.

Here's for you an example video showing israelis:

https://youtu.be/8RVoPZPKxLY?si=Z-T_iKehTsfJ7xMq

It doesn't look good.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by gedy on Thursday March 06, 2025 @09:15AM (#43280432)
> What did Israel compromise on?

They did have Jewish settlements in Gaza that they forcibly removed. They gave the Sinai back to Egypt, etc.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by siltcakes on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:08AM (#43281085)
Zionists have carpet bombed Gaza so it makes sense that they removed their own people first.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by gedy on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:18AM (#43281215)
Come on, that's a silly hot take. The settlements were removed 20 years ago and the settlers didn't want to leave.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by siltcakes on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:51AM (#43281601)
The Zionist intention was always to ethnically cleanse "greater israel", their motive has been complete ethnic cleansing since Zionism's inception.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:04AM (#43281038)
Why would they "compromise" with the people who stole their land. Were the Jews meant to "compromise" with the Nazis?
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Thursday March 06, 2025 @01:17PM (#43283285)
You are wrong.

No land was stolen. Up until 1948 all lands inhabited by jews were purchased from their legal owners - I challenge you - please show me a case where palestinians had their land "stolen" pre-1948.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by xg15 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @02:06PM (#43283931)
6.6%, according to Wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_land_purchase_in_Palest...

Also note, from the same page:

> The purchase of land was often accompanied by the eviction of the Arab tenants.

> When it came to the national aspirations of the Zionist movement, the Ottoman Empire opposed the idea of Jewish self-rule in Palestine, fearing it might lose control of Palestine after recently having lost other territories to various European powers.

> In 1881 the Ottoman governmental administration (the Sublime Porte) decreed that foreign Jews could immigrate to and settle anywhere within the Ottoman Empire, except in Palestine and from 1882 until their defeat in 1918, the Ottomans continuously restricted Jewish immigration and land purchases in Palestine.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Friday March 07, 2025 @02:54AM (#43288081)
Ok now we're getting somewhere.

Can we agree now that no land was stolen? It was purchased from their rightful owners and then, according to Ilan Pappe, ( the one whose book is cited claiming Arab tenants were evicted) who is a known anti Zionist, and hardly an impartial investigator, "often" Arab tenants were evicted.

This is a claim, not an evidence

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Thursday March 06, 2025 @02:03PM (#43283909)
The Balfour Declaration and Nakba are things you desperately need to read up on.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Friday March 07, 2025 @04:58AM (#43288814)
I've read all about those, thanks for the suggestion.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by mungoman2 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:29AM (#43279957)
Currently, 146 UN member states (75%) recognize the State of Palestine.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by koutetsu on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:59AM (#43280250)
Yes, but most of them are from the global south. The USA, Canada, countries in western Europe (except for Spain and Irelandand those are the same countries always talking about a 2 state solution. That's very hypocritical.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by jltsiren on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:14AM (#43278812)
Jordan has taken far more refugees relative to is size than Turkey and Germany. Its population of 11.5 million includes 1.4 million Syrian refugees, 300-400k Palestinian refugees still living in refugee camps (and at least 1.5 million who have gained citizenship), and 1+ million illegal immigrants. There were also ~1 million Iraqi refugees in the 2000s, but most of them eventually returned home. It's kind of surprising that the country is still mostly functional and stable, despite all this.

Egypt is kind of overpopulated. Most of the country is uninhabitable, and the Nile from Aswan to the Mediterranean is effectively a contiguous chain of settlements with a total of ~100 million people. The current administration also doesn't want to import Hamas, because they have enough trouble with the Muslim Brotherhood, which used to be the parent group of Hamas.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by botanical on Thursday March 06, 2025 @07:51AM (#43279653)
The idea of Hamas will never be eradicated for as long as Palestinians live under occupation and dehumanisation. Hamas came to be after Palestinian land was occupied, large swathes stolen and its people killed by Apartheid Israel.

There already are 5.6 million refugees in Jordan and neighbouring countries, created by Israel's ethnic cleansing of Palestinians; that's almost half the population of Israel. Why should Palestinians forcibly leave their own land?

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by wruza on Thursday March 06, 2025 @05:55AM (#43278676)
It stems from that nice picture that politicians of the first world paint to their voters. Which is, there are countries, and they all live in friendship, and sometimes boo boo happens and good guys do good things and bad guys don’t do good things. This political infantilization goes all over the world.

I learn nothing about that region cause there’s no need to. Absolutely sure that Gaza conflict is not about historically bad neighborship, but about multiple large political forces funding armed groups to retain various destabilizing vectors. And both Jordan and Egypt and a bunch of other clans around have their hands elbow deep in this muppet show, while being partially sponsored by the same good guys who call for the resolve.

Also, even in a scenario where this happens, Hamas will feel betrayed and won’t just allow mass exodus for free. Meat shield is all it has.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by pjc50 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:22AM (#43278871)
> about multiple large political forces funding armed groups to retain various destabilizing vectors

Especially Iran, but also Hamas can freely fundraise in several of the other gulf states.

Don't forget that there are internal anti-peace factions on the Israeli side too, such as those who assassinated Yitzhak Rabin and terminated the last working peace process.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:05AM (#43278742)
I agree. the good vs. bad guys narrative that dominates many western countries is toxic.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by siltcakes on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:12AM (#43281131)
People should learn about Palestine because all you have to do is read about The Balfour Declaration and Nakba and it becomes crystal clear that the Zionists are "the bad guys", is there doubt about Nazis? It's the same situation.
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by regularjack on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:19AM (#43278856)
Ideas cannot be eradicated
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by volleyball on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:11AM (#43278789)
The majority of Gaza's residents are 'temporary' refugees from the Nakba[1] in 1948. Trump and Netanyahu have also cleared any lingering doubt in their mind about being able to come back if they ever leave. Trump literally said that they won't come back. And Israel and its allies are working hard to dismantle UNRWA which tracks the refugees status of 6 million displaced palestinians. All this is part of Israel's three-pronged strategy of ethnic-cleansing, genocide, and apartheid.

The leaders of Egypt, Jordan and people of Gaza know better than to fall for such an obvious ruse. Anyone arguing otherwise is clearly ignorant or speaking in bad faith.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by Protostome on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:20AM (#43278861)
The refugee status of Gazan and other palestinian has been strategically kept this way for generations.

Many peoples have suffered wars throughout history, were displaced and relocated in other countries. Only the palestinians retain their refugee status even after living in surrounding arab countries like Lebanon, Syria for more than 3 generations.

There are more than 2 million arabs that remained in Israel and didn't flee during the 1948 wars, they are all full citizens now, in full contrast.

The only reason for keeping palestinians in a refugee status is to keep the conflict going until the eradication of the state of Israel.

UNRWA is a known cover for laundrying Hamas activities, there are many accounts of Hamas members firing and conducting military activities wearing UNRWA uniforms and traveling in UNRWA vehicles. That's why many countries stopped supporting them financially

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by alexisread on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:06AM (#43279758)
Most countries restarted funding when Israel did not produce any evidence of UNRWA malfeasance to back up their allegation.

The arabs within Israel do not have equal status to Israeli nationals, and less than any Jew who claims lineage but has no connection to Israel. Refugee status is also maintained by Israeli rulings about refugees from Palestine, in order to delegitimize right of return: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_citizenship_law https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2021/6/29/israeli-aparthe...

Furthermore, the UN have ruled that the right of return is valid, as opposed to the current nationality rules around Jewish heritage that make no sense - no other countries allow similar things: https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/09/1154496

Neighbouring countries accepting refugees could well be considered an endorsement of ethnic cleansing. TBH Gazans should not have to move, the current state of Gaza is entirely down to Israeli destruction which was completely unnecessary - hostage exchange could have happened at any time in the last 15 months, and Netenyahu has blocked that discourse 10+ times before, as it has not been in his interests to seek a resolution to the conflict (witness the complaints by the families of the Israeli hostages).

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by gedy on Thursday March 06, 2025 @08:36AM (#43280017)
> Many peoples have suffered wars throughout history, were displaced and relocated in other countries.

Yes, at the same time in Europe, millions of people were kicked out of their homes because of redrawing borders and ethnic cleansing of many regions after WW2. Look up the history of Displaced Persons.

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by xg15 on Thursday March 06, 2025 @09:08AM (#43280340)
> Many peoples have suffered wars throughout history, were displaced and relocated in other countries.

This is Israel's weird hasbara logic of "19th century imperialist rules for us, 20 century postwar rules for everyone else". The prohibition of taking land by force is a central rule of the post-WWII world order, yet it seems to apply to all except Israel.

Also, large-scale waves of refugees are always a challenge for the host countries, and I don't know about any situation where the host country didn't want the refugees to go back eventually. (Not even speaking about the refugees themselves, who have to start a new life with basically nothing)

Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:03AM (#43281024)
Israel gets handouts from many countries including the US and still talks about the holocaust, which pre-dates the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians. It's quite hypocritical that WWII is "never again" but Nakba is "just get over it".
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by 2Gkashmiri on Thursday March 06, 2025 @06:36AM (#43278990)
uh.. why doesnt israel not do genocide for once?
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by bbqfog on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:01AM (#43281003)
They don't want to support Israel's ethnic cleansing of Palestine. Why doesn't Europe take all of the Zionists so we can return Palestine to the Palestinians?
Re:'Trump Gaza' AI video intended as political satire, says ... by siltcakes on Thursday March 06, 2025 @10:07AM (#43281073)
There would be no refugees if it wasn't for Zionism. Most of the world recognizes that Zionism is a crime against humanity and the generations that don't are rapidly aging.