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Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by bloomingkales on Thursday February 06, 2025 @07:19PM (#42967888)
There is definitely a mini cult of people that want to be very right about how everyone else is very wrong about AI.
Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by ggm on Thursday February 06, 2025 @08:07PM (#42968173)
Firstly this is meta ad hom. You're ignoring the argument to target the speaker(s)

Secondly, you're ignoring the fact that the community of voices with experience in data sciences, computer science and artificial intelligence themselves are split on the qualities or lack of them in current AI. GPT and LLM are very interesting but say little or nothing to me of new theory of mind, or display inductive logic and reasoning, or even meet the bar for a philosophers cave solution to problems. We've been here before so many, many times. "Just a bit more power captain" was very strong in connectionist theories of mind. fMRI brains activity analytics, you name it.

So yes. There are a lot of "us" who are pushing back on the hype, and no we're not a mini cult.

Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by visarga on Thursday February 06, 2025 @11:25PM (#42969364)
> GPT and LLM are very interesting but say little or nothing to me of new theory of mind, or display inductive logic and reasoning, or even meet the bar for a philosophers cave solution to problems.

The simple fact they can generate language so well makes me think... maybe language itself carries more weight than we originally thought. LLMs can get to this point without personal experience and embodiment, it should not have been possible, but here we are.

I think philosophers are lagging science now. The RL paradigm of agent-environment-reward based learning seems to me a better one than what we have in philiosophy now. And if you look at how LLMs model language as high dimensional embedding spaces .. this could solve many intractable philosophical problems, like the infinite homunculus regress problem. Relational representations straddle the midpoint between 1st and 3rd person, offering a possible path over the hard problem "gap".

Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by mlinsey on Thursday February 06, 2025 @07:59PM (#42968131)
There are a couple Twitter personalities that definitely fit this description.

There is also a much bigger group of people that haven't really tried anything beyond GPT-3.5, which was the best you could get without paying a monthly subscription for a long time. One of the biggest reasons for r1 hype, besides the geopolitical angle, was people could actually try a reasoning model for free for the first time.

Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by danielmarkbruce on Thursday February 06, 2025 @07:21PM (#42967901)
ie, the people that AI is dumb? Or you are saying I'm in a cult for being pro it - I'm definitely part of that cult - the "we already have agi and you have to contort yourself into a pretzel to believe otherwise" cult. Not sure if there is a leader though.
Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by jamiek88 on Thursday February 06, 2025 @08:13PM (#42968196)
You think we have AGI? What makes you think that?
Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by danielmarkbruce on Thursday February 06, 2025 @08:32PM (#42968297)
By knowing what each of the letters stand for
Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by jamiek88 on Thursday February 06, 2025 @08:49PM (#42968393)
Well that’s disappointing. It was an extraordinary claim that really interested me.

Thought I was about to be learn!

Instead, I just met an asshole.

Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by danielmarkbruce on Thursday February 06, 2025 @09:24PM (#42968604)
When someone says "i'm in the cult that believes X", don't expect a water tight argument for the existence of X.
Re:Understanding Reasoning LLMs by bloomingkales on Thursday February 06, 2025 @07:27PM (#42967940)
I didn't realize my post can be interpreted either way. I'll leave it ambiguous, hah. Place your bets I guess.