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Re:The Zizians and the Rationalist Death Cult by 01100011 on Sunday February 02, 2025 @03:25AM (#42907105)
Another thing I'll add after having spent a few years in a religious cult:

It's all about the axioms. If you tweak the axioms you can use impeccable logic to build a completely incorrect framework that will appeal to otherwise intelligent(and often highly intelligent) people.

Also, people are always less rational than they are able to admit. The force of things like social connection can very easily warp the reasoning capabilities of the most devout rationalist(although they'll likely never admit that).

Re:The Zizians and the Rationalist Death Cult by CPLX on Sunday February 02, 2025 @07:10AM (#42908171)
Right, and a related problem is a lot of the logic is more like Zeno’s paradox.
Re:The Zizians and the Rationalist Death Cult by janderson215 on Sunday February 02, 2025 @08:20AM (#42908459)
Succinct. This should be handed out as a “Signs you’re being manipulated” flyer to young people.
Re:The Zizians and the Rationalist Death Cult by rng-concern on Sunday February 02, 2025 @09:14AM (#42908748)
The axioms of rationality, morality, etc. I've always found interesting.

We have certain axioms, (let me chose an arbitrary, and possibly not quite an axiomy-enough example): "human life has value". We hold this to be self-evident and construct our society around it.

We also often don't realize that other people and cultures have different axioms of morality. We talk/theorize at this high level, but don't realize we have different foundations.

Re:The Zizians and the Rationalist Death Cult by simplicio on Sunday February 02, 2025 @09:57AM (#42909016)
Im kinda skeptical these folks were following some hyper-logical process from flawed axioms that led them to the rigorous solution: "I should go stab our land-lord with a samurai sword" or "I should start a shootout with the Feds".

The rationalist stuff just seems like some meaningless patter they stuck ontop of more garden variety cult stuff.

Re:The Zizians and the Rationalist Death Cult by dartos on Sunday February 02, 2025 @10:26AM (#42909215)
If you convince someone smart who errs towards logic of your axioms, they’ll convince themselves to do whatever you want.