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Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by mjburgess on Thursday December 12, 2024 @05:45AM (#42398083)
His claim is just that AGI will largely be comprised of stateless mathematical operations -- all of which could be a single line of code if written that way.

As a claim, it's antique -- it would easily have been a view of Turing and others many decades ago.

And as a claim its as false then as now. Not least because all the code which is the actual algorithm for generating an LLM is all the code that goes into its data collection which is just being inlined (/cached) with weights.

However, more than that, it's an extremely impoverished view of general intelligence which eliminates any connection between intelligence and a body. All the "lines of code" beyond a single are concerned with I/O and device manipulation.

Thus this is just another way of repeating the antique superstition that intelligence has nothing to do with embodiment.

Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by DrBazza on Thursday December 12, 2024 @06:38AM (#42398333)
> As a claim, it's antique -- it would easily have been a view of Turing and others many decades ago.

Absolutely.

We discussed this in the 90s and were of the opinion, then, that event state of the art NNs (in the 90s) wouldn't get much more complex because of their actual mathematical descriptions.

It's all the bells and whistles around managing training, and real-world input/output translation code.

The core or 'general case' always will be tiny.

Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by n4r9 on Thursday December 12, 2024 @06:01AM (#42398163)
> antique claim ... extremely impoverished ... antique supersition

Frankly, when the total argument against a position consists of such "boo" words, I immediately suspect some projection of personal preferences.

But anyway I googled "intelligence vs embodiment" and found this quite nice summary albeit from 2012: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3512413/

The basic idea seems to be that human conscious experience is a mishmash of sensory-reflexive impulses and internal deliberation, combined into a sophisticated narrative. Simulating this kind of combination may help robots to move about in the world and to relate more closely to human experience. I have a lot of sympathy with this although I'm guarded about how much it really tells us about the potentials for AGI.

> Not least because all the code which is the actual algorithm for generating an LLM is all the code that goes into its data collection which is just being inlined (/cached) with weights.

Could this "data collection" code not potentially be put into a few thousand lines also?

Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by GTP on Thursday December 12, 2024 @06:44AM (#42398374)
> Could this "data collection" code not potentially be put into a few thousand lines also?

This would mean hardcoding a model of the world. Which maybe, with the help of some breakthrough from physics, would be possibe (but I think the kind of breakthrough needed to get down to such a small size would be a theory of everything). But this means eliminating the self-learning part of current neural networks, which is what makes them attractive: you don't have to hardcode the rules, as the model will be able to learn them.

Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by n4r9 on Thursday December 12, 2024 @06:52AM (#42398413)
What I mean is, we could program an entity which gathers its own data and updates its own weights. With the lines of code being in the tens of thousands.
Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by GTP on Thursday December 12, 2024 @07:06AM (#42398482)
But op's point was about people talking about tiny LLMs failing to consider the amount of parameters used. This has nothing to do with the ability of autonomously collecting the training data.
Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by antonvs on Thursday December 12, 2024 @08:21AM (#42398900)
Executing computer code is embodied in a physical machine. Modern machines have vision and audio I/O capabilities, for example.

You seem to be assuming, without any evidence, a narrow view of what embodiment entails.

The "antique superstition" claim is particularly ironic in this context, since it much more clearly applies to your own apparently irrational hasty conclusion.

Re:A ChatGPT clone, in 3000 bytes of C, backed by GPT-2 by mjburgess on Thursday December 12, 2024 @08:34AM (#42398998)
What claim do you think I'm making?