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A comment on React 19. Parent comment

Re:React 19 by recursivedoubts on Tuesday December 10, 2024 @09:02AM (#42376890)
ceteris is rarely paribus: JSON-based APIs have to make a choice between being general purpose, in which case a web app written against them may end up chatty with multiple requests per page, or they end up application specific, in which case they can be churney and a bad general purpose API.

I wrote an essay about this here:

https://htmx.org/essays/splitting-your-apis/

Also, producing JSON often involves reflection and can be more CPU intensive than straight templating (w/ fixed properly lookups) depending on your technology. Finally, the size delta between JSON and hypermedia is lower than most people think, particularly with compression:

https://github.com/1cg/html-json-size-comparison

in most real world systems i expect data store access to be the dominant latency issue

some people have had good success w/htmx from a performance perspective (2x+ speed, 1/2 memory consumption):

https://htmx.org/essays/a-real-world-react-to-htmx-port/

but of course it depends on your use case.

I think htmx would be excellent for an e-commerce site, which is mostly text and images and relatively simple, coarse-grained user interactions.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:React 19 by jakubmazanec on Tuesday December 10, 2024 @09:42AM (#42377246)
As I said, using HTMX isn't "minimal to no JS". I agree that HTMX can be fast - but that's not what we're talking about. Even in the video of converting a React app to HTMX you linked the presenter literally says - "no JavaScript, just HTMX" - but HTMX is written in guess what? Very dishonest.
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Re:React 19 by recursivedoubts on Tuesday December 10, 2024 @09:53AM (#42377384)
i think it's reasonable to call htmx "minimal JS" in that it is relatively small, dependency free, can be used without a typical javascript build chain (npm, etc.) and frees the end user of writing javascript in many cases

the speaker is referring to them not needing to write javascript for a specific feature, which is true, but they do use scripting for some aspects of the application, which is perfectly acceptable in hypermedia-driven applications:

https://htmx.org/essays/hypermedia-friendly-scripting/

regardless, the wins are obvious

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:React 19 by jakubmazanec on Wednesday December 11, 2024 @04:06AM (#42386071)
> call htmx "minimal JS"

"Minimal", maybe, "small to no", nay :D

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:React 19 by troad on Wednesday December 11, 2024 @04:26AM (#42386175)
> "Minimal", maybe, "small to no", nay :D

Considering the original phrase was 'minimal or no', I am glad that you now agree.

> you linked the presenter literally says - "no JavaScript, just HTMX" - but HTMX is written in guess what? Very dishonest.

It's difficult to take this seriously. Just wait until you find out most of Python is written in C! Very dishonest!

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:React 19 by jakubmazanec on Wednesday December 11, 2024 @06:46AM (#42386850)
On the contrary, you are still wrong. HTMX is simply using JavaScript and looking at it, it isn't minimal (it's still 15 kB min+gzip).

> It's difficult to take this seriously. Just wait until you find out most of Python is written in C! Very dishonest!

Now I understand, you're just obtuse.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:React 19 by troad on Wednesday December 11, 2024 @06:56AM (#42386901)
> Now I understand, you're just obtuse.

This seems like an exceedingly mean-spirited and unconstructive type of response to have to people who have been giving up their time trying to explain a different point of view to you. I would also gently point out the HN guidelines at this point.

I note you haven't responded to my more substantive reply here,[0] so I am unsure you saw it. I would encourage you to read it with less of a zero-sum 'I-win-you-lose' mentality. I won't be engaging with you further though.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42386090

[ Parent | on HN ]