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Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by fauigerzigerk on Saturday January 03, 2009 @03:32PM (#418652)
What would you do to prepare if you knew the journey back in time would start in one hour?
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by swombat on Saturday January 03, 2009 @03:36PM (#418658)
Pray that I'll be transported to the Middle East, where it is warmer, and where the arabs of the time were vastly more enlightened and tolerant than most of Europe. They might keep me alive long enough for me to learn Arabic and learn to blend in..
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by vaksel on Saturday January 03, 2009 @03:38PM (#418661)
Backpack full of seeds. Potatoes, corn, etc etc. The agriculture of that time was pretty much non-existent. You'd get something like 20x the output from your seeds.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by nostrademons on Sunday January 04, 2009 @01:49AM (#419077)
Most modern crops have been bred or genetically engineered so that they physically cannot survive on their own. They need petrochemical fertilizers to grow, pesticides to fend off insects & fungi & disease, mechanized tilling to penetrate the ground, and artificial supports so they can stand up and avoid keeling over.

In my sustainable agriculture course, I read that modern grain varieties put 60% of their photosynthesized energy into growing the fruit (the edible portion of the grain). Wild varieties put more like 3% into the fruit. There's your 20x difference in yield. But it comes at the expense of every other survival mechanism of the plant: modern grain varieties yield so much grain because they don't have working systems for anything, be it support, storm resistance, disease resistance, or general hardiness. They give us food because we supply them with a good amount of fossil-fuel derived work.

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by ntoshev on Sunday January 04, 2009 @08:13AM (#419230)
Thanks for the insight. It's interesting why the external work supplied to the plants still costs less than growing plants that can do these things itself. I suppose chemistry and mechanization in agriculture are just much more efficient than their biological counterparts.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by bd on Sunday January 04, 2009 @01:26PM (#419356)
Using externally supplied fossil-fuel is kind of cheating. The energy still comes from photosynthesis, but the energy that was created over eons is used in (geological) moments.

It's somehow similar venture capital. It's a resource produced in older times that allows you to get temporary advantage compared to somebody that uses just in-time generated resources.

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by randallsquared on Sunday January 04, 2009 @11:37AM (#419299)
Almost certainly not more efficient, but growing plants can't use oil directly, and since we can supply enormous amounts of external energy by the standards of a crop plant, engineering them to be able to use it more effectively is useful even if the plant itself is less efficient overall.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by nostrademons on Sunday January 04, 2009 @12:32PM (#419325)
Almost any sort of mechanical or chemical process is more efficient than plants. Photosynthesis is only 3% efficient; by the time the energy enters the plant, you've lost 97% of it. Then you figure various biological pathways, and you're down to maybe 1-2% efficiency for the best plants.

This, among other reasons, is why grain ethanol was such a scam.

The worst mechanical processes, by contrast, usually get at least 10-15% efficiency. That's what photovoltaics can do, for example. Gasoline engines have a thermal efficiency of about 30%, diesel about 45%. Granted, you lose energy in the extraction/refining/transportation steps, but it's still an order of magnitude more efficient than photosynthesis.

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by randallsquared on Sunday January 04, 2009 @08:34PM (#419822)
I did not know that. Thanks.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by opticksversi on Wednesday January 07, 2009 @08:48PM (#424323)
http://www.life.uiuc.edu/govindjee/whatisit.htm

The primary [photosynthetic] reactions have close to 100% quantum efficiency (i.e., one quantum of light leads to one electron transfer); and under most ideal conditions, the overall energy efficiency can reach 35%. Due to losses at all steps in biochemistry, one has been able to get only about 1 to 2% energy efficiency in most crop plants. Sugarcane is an exception as it can have almost 8% efficiency.

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by ntoshev on Sunday January 04, 2009 @12:10PM (#419313)
Not sure if energy is important part of the equation. Protection from diseases and weather doesn't seem to require energy, it's about chemistry and structure.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by evgen on Sunday January 04, 2009 @05:35PM (#419636)
Given the millions of backyard gardeners who produce yields beyond what the most productive mechanized farms of the early 20th century were capable of this claim is demonstably false. Contrary to the BS you are apparently swallowing with little skepticism from this class, modern varieties are not completely dependent upon heavy loads of fertilizer, etc. What makes them different is that when provided these addditional resources they will thrive and produce a large yield instead of shutting down and they can toldate being overcrowded (as well as having the structure to support the he's ier yield).
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by russell on Saturday January 03, 2009 @08:59PM (#418882)
Commercial corn is a sterile hybrid. Potatoes are heavy, but you can carry lots of beet and turnip seeds, good for high volume food production.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by evgen on Sunday January 04, 2009 @05:39PM (#419644)
Not only was the agriculture of the time primitive, but you could bring new-world plants and make a mint... Potatoes are one of the most calorie-rich crops on a per-acre basis and a modern sugar beet or super sweet corn variety would be very popular. If tobacco was not such a diificult plant to cultvate you could make a fortune from just a pocketfull of seeds and a couple of growing seasons :)
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by rsheridan6 on Saturday January 03, 2009 @11:56PM (#419006)
I would print out plans or at least a description of something like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinning_jenny

This machine was not invented yet at the time, but could have been made by any decent medieval carpenter. I could probably do it with an axe and a saw. It would have been quite valuable at the time, and could make you rich if you played your cards right.

Of course, that doesn't help solve the problem of immediate survival in a world where you don't speak anybody's language...

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by ctingom on Saturday January 03, 2009 @04:01PM (#418669)
I think I'd grab a gun and some ammo and maybe get some jewelry and gold. And then I'd grab a history book.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by russell on Saturday January 03, 2009 @09:03PM (#418886)
I would add a good ski parka, extra boots, tooth brushes, and as much penicillin as I could scrounge up.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by daniel-cussen on Sunday January 04, 2009 @12:13AM (#419018)
I would add a AK-47 with plenty of rounds.
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by skorgu on Monday January 05, 2009 @09:32AM (#420459)
I'd grab my Wagner's Chemical Technology 1872, a Pocket Ref, a hatchet, my wristwatch (automatic movement, no batteries), my Leatherman, every knife in my kitchen and the entire contents of my medicine cabinet (asprin, alcohol, gauze, etc). That ought to fit in a large backpack. Maybe some nylon rope if I could dig it up fast enough.

Yes this is all stuff in my house at the moment.

If I had more time I'd buy a 9mm revolver, load up a Kindle with reference books from demonoid and start working out.

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by cturner on Saturday January 03, 2009 @04:36PM (#418702)
Pack a latin version of the graduale and as much church music as I could cram in a bag. If the bag wasn't coming with me I'd read up on the survivalist websites. Making a compass, that sort of thing.

The thing I'd be most worried about is dental hygiene. How do you look after yourself if you don't have a toothbrush and floss? I suppose there'd be less white sugar, which would help. What food you could get would taste bland and generally be awful.

Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by ars on Saturday January 03, 2009 @08:33PM (#418858)
You don't need a toothbrush or floss, just use a cloth and some salt (if you could get it, depends on exactly where you ended up).
Re:Survival tips if you find yourself in the Middle Ages? by marketer on Sunday January 04, 2009 @02:37PM (#419424)
I suppose it would be like an extended camping trip.

First I'd go to the local book store and buy as many survival guides as I can get my hands on.

Then I'd buy some high quality tools - knives, leathermans, nail clippers, matches, first aid kits, etc..... Many of these would be priceless for that era.

I'd try to buy a small waterproof tent. Maybe a sleeping bag if it's not too large to carry. If not a sleeping bag, at least pack some warm water-resistant clothes.

If there's time I'd print out some Wikipedia articles about agriculture techniques, subsistence farming, natural medicines and fertilizers. Maybe find some information about edible insects and plants. Basically anything that helps you survive in the beginning.