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Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by Waterluvian on Thursday April 04, 2024 @07:48AM (#39929127)
A lot of talk on missing air defenses for this topic. But I’m curious about the lack of radar detection and Air Force intercept on such a slow plane. It seems like this might be a weapon that can exploit Russian incompetence, but would otherwise be written off as too easily defeated to be worth considering.
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by KingOfCoders on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:02AM (#39929273)
I think Russia doesn't have an unlimited supply of AA weapons. Most are close to the front, many around Moscow and St.Petersburg, and there are many factories and refineries in Russia to cover.

Why their drone factory is not defended properly though, beats me.

Also don't forget Mathias Rust, who landed near the Red Square with a Cessna in 1987, who was tracked, lost, tracked again and lost again.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by tokai on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:05AM (#39929304)
Maybe they were defending them. Ukrainians have successfully used multiple waves to 'off load' AA defense in Crimea.
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by go88faxme on Monday April 08, 2024 @04:55AM (#39967632)
They dont have to have unlimited. They only need to be more than effective for their nukes to wipe American off the planet. Say 8K nukes delivered to USA with 95% effective detonation, while USA deliver just 30% effectiveness. And that is probably only less than 2K can be launched (30% out of 2K against a target area twice American size). Americans weapon effectiveness are at joke level these days. Russians will rewrite human civilizations and Americans will only be a minor Russian history footnote 200 years from now. And we havnt count in Indians and Chinese making Americans 300M truly irrelevant in future global populations even with nuke wars happening. Dont believe me, look at Solyndra competiting against Chinese solar panel. They are gone and no one even remember much. Or how about Segway? You probably know Xiaomi and Ninebot more. Motorola? A lot of Americans corporations now erased from public memory and dominated by Chinese one. American culture also significantly reduced compare to what it was in the heydays of 70s.
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by scherlock on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:10AM (#39929367)
Might be a slow moving, low flying civilian air craft isn't what the AA system is looking for as a possible threat.
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by tokai on Thursday April 04, 2024 @07:55AM (#39929194)
Its not even incompetence. Its impossible to cover such a big area with radar and AA.
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by TulliusCicero on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:12AM (#39929388)
I mean you don't have to cover the entire area of the country, you can cover the borders and then around key potential target areas, right?

In this case, they would of course want to focus on the border with Ukraine, unless Ukraine somehow starts launching these from entirely different countries.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by tibbydudeza on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:13AM (#39929395)
Well they had airborne radar systems but the Ukrainians downed one A50.

Those aircraft are irreplicable - no longer manufactured and it took them a few years at great cost to build the 6 they have now never mind training the crew to operate it.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by TheLoafOfBread on Thursday April 04, 2024 @03:01PM (#39934481)
Actually they downed 2. First above Azov sea Jan 14th 2024, which Russians furiously claimed that it was work of their own SAM. Second 23rd of February, where was also a video of A50 dropping flares and then getting hit.

Furthermore there is one A50 getting attacked by FPV while on Airport in Belarus on Feb 26th 2023 and attack on Taganrog service airbase in March 2024 where hangar was targeted, according to satellite one A50 destroyed.

That makes 4 of 6 lost?

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by rainworld on Saturday April 06, 2024 @02:42PM (#39954454)
One FF more or less admitted, maybe two. In the later case we have the missile launch on tape. No Ukies anywhere close. Belarus a hilariously wasted opportunity. Taganrog on tape flying away the next day.

So in short, 1–2 destroyed, 0/4 destroyed by Ukraine. Also, even Budallo said six A-50U remaining.

Also, they are not “irreplacable”. A-50U production got restarted, there’s a number of airframes to upgrade/refurbish, plus there’s the A-100 project.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by tibbydudeza on Saturday April 06, 2024 @03:10PM (#39954650)
A100 project has been talked about for years and Ukraine already drone striked the plant where the A50 refurbishments happen (there is only one in Russia thanks to central planning).

It smacked into the hangar where the damaged A50 from Belarus was being repaired.

Cold war relic and in the mean time NATO is flying off in international waters near the Black Sea sending back telemetry and signals data to Kyiv - not the kind of war that Russia ever thought about.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by rainworld on Saturday April 06, 2024 @05:22PM (#39955698)
Nice little touchdown it was. But that’s all it was. At least there was some doubt and ambiguity then; these days it’s just plain parallel universes: https://x.com/chronology22/status/1776661958827151663

>not the kind of war Russia ever thought about

Did the NATO ubermenschen of March ‘22 imagine getting themselves fried in musty old Soviet bunkers? Did they imagine they’d end up burning a cool quarter trillion and still lose? Did they picture their fancy schmancy hangar queens stuck deep in mud, being among the easiest prey for the new threats? Did they picture entire Patriot batteries gone in one strike? Did they unironically think they could “just drive around” or punch through the minefields? Did they ever consider the logistics of something that wasn’t a three week airland wet dream? Barrels? Shells?

Did Ukropians think twice before dooming themselves demographically and economically, for updoots and likes?

Good news, this isn’t even the funny part yet.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by TheLoafOfBread on Monday April 08, 2024 @02:01AM (#39966652)
After 4 were destroyed, they stopped appearing in Azov sea. If it would be just a FF, they could have solved it by improving AA processes, but Russians stopped using A50 in general.
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by Waterluvian on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:03AM (#39929291)
At 50 miles range each hound aviation radar, I’d of imagined a sort of screen, placing them every 100 miles towards the Ukrainian border. But perhaps that’s not something they’re equipped to handle?
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by dmos62 on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:34AM (#39929598)
Can low-flying defeat those?
Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by tibbydudeza on Thursday April 04, 2024 @08:09AM (#39929356)
Afaik Russian air defense systems are geared towards intercepting fast moving ballistic objects and not slow propeller driven aircraft flying close to the ground hence why Ukranian drone strikes are so difficult for them to intercept.

You need air defense systems that are geared towards that like the Gepard and NASAMS and not Patroits.

Re:Ukraine's New Factory-Smashing Drone Is a $90k Sport Plan... by bluGill on Thursday April 04, 2024 @09:44AM (#39930343)
Russia is big. They cannot cover the whole country so they prioritize what they think are high value/risk targets by moving protection to those places leaving less risk places undefended. In turn Ukraine is looking for places not protected.

Note that this factory was thought to be beyond Ukraine's reach. So considering it very low risk and thus not worth protected seemed like the right choice. Only in hindsight do we know it is in reach and thus not very low risk. Even now it is hard to know how Russia should assign risk.