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Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by zmgsabst on Saturday February 17, 2024 @09:23AM (#39409644)
Game theory tells us the most effective strategy is matching their energy until they shift modalities.

Sometimes, adults deny this truth to their own detriment because they’re “smart” or “civilized”.

Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by sieste on Saturday February 17, 2024 @09:59AM (#39410004)
Interesting, what's the game theory argument for this strategy?
Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by zmgsabst on Saturday February 17, 2024 @11:01AM (#39410633)
Iterated prisoner’s dilemma.

The optimal strategy is signaling alliance (to receptive partners); after that, it’s reciprocating behavior.

Teenagers (and many adults) aren’t willing to ally, so we’re left with reciprocating. Until they accept being allies is a good idea.

Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by CrazyStat on Saturday February 17, 2024 @11:40AM (#39411018)
Game theory does not tell us that tit for tat is generally optimal. It tells us that it is optimal for a specific game with specific rules and payouts.

It is a mistake to try to translate that to using a tit for tat strategy in general, where the rules and payouts are usually quite different.

Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by _Algernon_ on Saturday February 17, 2024 @11:46AM (#39411080)
It's not even always the optimal strategy playing prisoner's dilemma. If all your opponents are playing "always defect", playing Tit-for-tat will consistently lose (because of the initial good-faith attempt at cooperation).
Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by knightoffaith on Saturday February 17, 2024 @12:26PM (#39411395)
Right - if I recall, the story is that there were computer-simulated tournaments in which different strategies for playing the iterated prisoner's dilemma were pitted against each other, and tit-for-tat is the strategy that emerged to be the winner. So it's an empirical result showing that it is generally the most successful strategy, not mathematically shown to be optimal against every strategy.
Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by tremon on Saturday February 17, 2024 @05:51PM (#39414299)
It's not about the specific game nor the specific payout. When raising children, it's more important to teach/demonstrate that negative behaviour does have negative consequences.
Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by CrazyStat on Saturday February 17, 2024 @06:15PM (#39414465)
I was responding to a claim about what game theory tells us.
Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by pharrington on Saturday February 17, 2024 @03:03PM (#39412959)
>Game theory tells us

What game is being played? What are the rewards for winning?

Re:Juvenile great apes love to tease and annoy their elders,... by codersfocus on Saturday February 17, 2024 @04:01PM (#39413517)
1: Can I get their attention 2: Not being hassled for your attention