News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Go: What We Got Right, What We Got Wrong by coldtea on Saturday January 06, 2024 @05:50AM (#38890326)
>I appreciate your dedication to reminding us that your original comment was posted without any research or thought

I, on the other hand, don't appreciate the ad hominem. What happened, have manners gone out of style?

Also, what exactly fault do you find with my original comment: that Go isn't really a player in scientific computing. Does your "research or though" suggest otherwise?

>99% of Go users don't need an FFI story at all. They can choose a compiler on different merits.

Users of X don't need Y is a self-fullfilling prophecy when X doesn't offer Y. Languages without Y don't tend to attract users who need Y.

We're also talking about users doing scientific computing here, where the vast majority does need an FFI story.

>gc is not ideally suited to FFI. But Go offers compilers that are. This is not a Go problem. Go provides solutions. What you speak of is only a gc thing.

And gc is 99% of what people understand and use as Go - not gccgo. Unless gc has a good support for certain features, scientific computing ain't gonna happen.

People aren't going to heavily invest in building scientific programming libs interop with Go, when those would just work fast enough in a different less used go compiler as opposed to the mainstream one.

>What story do you have for us next? That your neighbourhood restaurant, with a full menu, has no hope because the one dish you tried wasn't to your existing taste – not having it occur to you that other items on the menu might be exactly what you are looking for?

Yeah, because a different version of a compiler doesn't come with different maturity, different technical tradeoffs, different community using it, different support story, and so on, it's just like "picking another item from a menu".

If that's your understanding of the situation, I can see how your argument would make sense in your mind ("just change the compiler, it's easy").

Using another language as an example: If CPython didn't have a good interop story with scientific libraries, even if PyPy did, "Python" would have gone nowhere in that domain.

And people who can't understand this, would talk all day getting blue in the face about how "it's not a Python problem, it's a CPython problem", as if that would change anything.

Re:Go: What We Got Right, What We Got Wrong by randomdata on Saturday January 06, 2024 @10:06AM (#38891989)
> What happened, have manners gone out of style?

Manners are for engagement between people. Forum-going is a solitary activity. Maybe there is a human out there twisting nobs and pulling levers to make the software work, but if so, that's just an implementation detail hidden from the user. If that were replaced with software, I wouldn't notice, or care.

> what exactly fault do you find with my original comment: that Go isn't really a player in scientific computing.

The original contextual comment, not first comment ever written...

> People aren't going to heavily invest in building scientific programming libs interop with Go

They aren't going to invest anyway, as the vast majority of scientific computing tasks are script in nature. Go is decidedly not a scripting language. It isn't trying to be, and doesn't want to be. There were already a number of good languages in the scripting space before Go came along.

This is like lamenting that wrenches aren't winning the race in nail driving dominance. Who cares?