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Re:What Happened to EVs? by prmoustache on Thursday January 04, 2024 @07:32AM (#38866190)
> In the suburban US, nothing is 15km away. All of the stores you typically go to are 0-5 miles way (grocery store, gas station, pharmacy, doctor, etc.).

Then why are people using cars so much if everything is at a walking distance?

Re:What Happened to EVs? by ryukafalz on Thursday January 04, 2024 @08:30AM (#38866738)
Because the infrastructure is designed such that it's not safe to do otherwise, and anything but driving is an afterthought. I have a shopping center just over a mile away from me but I'd be putting my life at risk walking or biking there.

I would love to be able to bike there safely. Wouldn't even take much longer than driving.

Re:What Happened to EVs? by ben_w on Thursday January 04, 2024 @08:08AM (#38866544)
Because the roads are dangerous to cross on foot, and the footpaths stop suddenly for no apparent reason. And there's no AC outside, which matters more in some parts of the USA than others (Davis (CA) and Salt Lake City are above my comfort threshold, from memory).

For example, one time I stayed at the The Cupertino Hotel in CA and tried walking to One Infinite Loop, a junction which every sufficiently old iOS user will be familiar with because it's what Apple used to use as the icon for their Maps app before they relocated their HQ to the flying saucer campus. The junction looks like this, and was an awful experience as a pedestrian:

https://www.google.com/maps/@37.3350322,-122.0325183,3a,75y,...

This is of course highly situational and varies by location. NYC, despite its reputation, was a lot less scary to walk around.

Re:What Happened to EVs? by prmoustache on Thursday January 04, 2024 @08:32AM (#38866754)
Now the additionnal question is why don't you guys do anything to correct the problem?
Re:What Happened to EVs? by natch on Thursday January 04, 2024 @08:55AM (#38866981)
Because driving seems to work just fine.
Re:What Happened to EVs? by acdha on Thursday January 04, 2024 @09:27AM (#38867366)
Other than the high annual death toll and millions of life-changing injuries annually, lowered health, significant impact on household income, and pollution, you mean?
Re:What Happened to EVs? by natch on Thursday January 04, 2024 @01:00PM (#38870162)
Yes, other than those.

And once all (or let's say most) vehicles are self driving and powered by sustainable energy, things will be overwhelmingly better on all those dimensions.

Meantime, you could adopt some driving-analog version of the following approach, but don't expect most of us to do so:

"The only truly secure system is one that is powered off, cast in a block of concrete and sealed in a lead-lined room with armed guards - and even then I have my doubts." --Spaf

Re:What Happened to EVs? by acdha on Thursday January 04, 2024 @06:47PM (#38873844)
> And once all (or let's say most) vehicles are self driving and powered by sustainable energy, things will be overwhelmingly better on all those dimensions.

This is only true for one of them and self-driving is still a long ways off. A self-driving EV still produces a lot of pollution (more than half of the CO2 is during manufacturing, and tire dust isn’t improved), costs a lot, and requires significant amounts of space to store and operate.

Nobody is saying there aren’t utility benefits but we shouldn’t continue massively subsidizing something while ignoring all of the problems. That’s why your analogy is nonsensical: spaf and the rest of the community didn’t say “perfect security is impossible, guess we shouldn’t do anything until AGI solves it for us!” and go to the bar.

Re:What Happened to EVs? by prmoustache on Friday January 05, 2024 @04:23AM (#38877226)
> And once all (or let's say most) vehicles are self driving and powered by sustainable energy, things will be overwhelmingly better on all those dimensions.

Nope.

In term of general health, on average people will still lower their life expectancy every time they use a self driving vehicle instead of riding your bicycle or walking for the same short trip.

Plus the horror in term of land management and the general effect it has on psych.

Re:What Happened to EVs? by ben_w on Thursday January 04, 2024 @08:47AM (#38866912)
Me? Well, the Americans don't let me vote, what with being British and living in Berlin (the original, not any of the 26 places of the same name in the USA), so the best I can do is point out to any Americans who feel like listening that there are better ways to design cities than the ways they've grown up with, and that "15 minute cities" are not the dystopian conspiracy theories that some seem to fear they are.
Re:What Happened to EVs? by aperson_hello on Thursday January 04, 2024 @09:38AM (#38867498)
Beyond all the safety stuff, it's also because that car often saves a huge amount of time compared to walking/biking - especially when there are multiple stops involved in an outing.

And that car can haul groceries, etc. much better than a bike or hands can. I have a grocery store well within walking distance of me (on safe-ish sidewalks even), but I only walk when I only have a few things to pick up because otherwise I'm trying to haul 50lb of fragile and bulky stuff back half a mile to my house by hand (I also tend to go there mostly while I'm already out doing other things, so the marginal additional mileage is nearly zero). Yes, I could take the approach of going to the grocery store every day, but I flat out don't have the time for that (or the weather for that!). Or I could take the approach of buying a much nicer bike with more hauling capacity, but I already have a car (and do enough with it that there's no reasonable way to go without one) so I'm not going to spend $2k on a bike that would only reduce my mileage by 100 miles a year. Heck...just the savings from fixing things DIY covers the cost of my car in a typical year (I have an old house!), not to mention the car rental fees I'd incur for trips pretty much anywhere outside of a 5-10 mile radius.

But to your point, this is also highly situational. If I were in an apartment in NYC, that's a completely different situation than being in a house in a small-size city (honestly, my city in the US even has public transport that nearly rivals comparable cities in Europe...but they key there is comparing to comparable cities in Europe...where everyone still has cars because to go anywhere outside of a small radius, they need a car).