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Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kragen on Thursday December 28, 2023 @09:06PM (#38801065)
as i understand it, that carve-out is included in us copyright law to ensure that you can legally xerox a book with permission from its author (or whoever they transferred the copyright to), without also getting permission from the font designer. in this case it makes the system simpler to navigate rather than more complex
Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by eru on Thursday December 28, 2023 @09:11PM (#38801089)
Maybe. But you can already xerox a book for private use without getting permission from the author anyway, can't you?
Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kube-system on Thursday December 28, 2023 @11:51PM (#38801846)
There's a lot of text that isn't covered under copyright at all. It would be a circus if widely published content that isn't eligible for copyright was illegal to photocopy because it was printed in a typeface that was.

For example, the IRS official fonts are Helvetica and Times New Roman. If in a hypothetical world, those were eligible for copyright, they'd still be within the duration of eligibility. Would it then be a copyright violation to print my tax form? I think that's silly, and I think the lawmakers who decided this thought the same.

Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by eru on Friday December 29, 2023 @12:01AM (#38801896)
> For example, the IRS official fonts are Helvetica and Times New Roman. If in a hypothetical world, those were eligible for copyright, they'd still be within the duration of eligibility. Would it then be a copyright violation to print my tax form? I think that's silly, and I think the lawmakers who decided this thought the same.

That's a weird hypothetical. Obviously, in that counterfactual world, the IRS would choose fonts that were either in the public domain or had permissive licenses.

Your hypothetical sounds like if speed limits on the highway were lowered, everyone would drive at the old speed and get a ticket, instead of adjusting their behaviour.

Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kragen on Friday December 29, 2023 @12:24AM (#38802024)
> Obviously, in that counterfactual world, the IRS would choose fonts that were either in the public domain or had permissive licenses.

there's nothing obvious about that at all; there are plenty of times when government agencies don't bend over backwards like that to ensure public access to their public-domain products. remember that what the fbi first investigated aaron swartz for was providing public access to pacer's court electronic records; pacer nominally stands for 'public access to court electronic records'

the westlaw page number fiasco is another example

you could even imagine a government rfq where different font foundries offer the irs the use of their fonts for below-market prices, thus gaining the right to charge people for printing their tax forms. and if you think that's an implausible level of corruption you probably haven't been following the ongoing saga of intuit's lobbying

Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by eru on Friday December 29, 2023 @01:08AM (#38802201)
Of course, one can always imagine suitably horrible levels of corruption / cronyism to make almost everything bad.
Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kragen on Friday December 29, 2023 @01:40AM (#38802318)
yeah, and fortunately congress did, and included safeguards against them
Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kube-system on Friday December 29, 2023 @12:11AM (#38801955)
You're right, it's a backwards hypothetical.

> the IRS would choose fonts that were either in the public domain or had permissive licenses.

Presuming a suitable option existed at the time, without requiring the IRS to make one themselves.

It would be silly if, by default, the purchaser of a printing press has no legal right to print anything with it.

Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by eru on Friday December 29, 2023 @01:08AM (#38802200)
Printing presses are older than (most) copyright laws.
Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kube-system on Friday December 29, 2023 @01:28AM (#38802271)
Yes, and they still existed when those laws were written. It would have been a strange shift to make overnight for any new printing presses, no?
Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by eru on Friday December 29, 2023 @05:41AM (#38803638)
Well, before those laws you could presumably copy anything, and after that you had to get the author's permission.

(I say presumably, because most likely those laws replaced some earlier similar regulations.)

Re:Smallest Typeface (3x3) by kragen on Thursday December 28, 2023 @09:22PM (#38801156)
if it's fair use; that may or may not cover every case of 'xerox a book for private use' but certainly the publishers who are suing library genesis under us law don't think it does