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Re:There Once Was an Empire by 082349872349872 on Thursday December 14, 2023 @05:17AM (#38639750)
> Hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way (1973)

Edit: although come to think of it, the British Empire so beloved of Brexiteers actually made it through the Great War (unlike Austria and Russia), hanging on right up until 1956.

Re:There Once Was an Empire by graemep on Thursday December 14, 2023 @06:54AM (#38640401)
I do not think it is true that the empire is beloved by Brexiteers.

As someone born in a former colony who voted leave, I was definitely not nostalgic for the empire. If anything I feel the EU is more nostalgic for the heights of European power than the UK - all the multipolar world stuff they love.

We are going back to a two super-power world, and China is the other super power.

Re:There Once Was an Empire by vidarh on Thursday December 14, 2023 @08:52AM (#38641302)
Depends how you define "beloved by Brexiteers".

According to [1], in 2020 "A third of people in the UK believe Britain’s colonies were better off for being part of an empire, a higher proportion than in any of the other major colonial powers, a global survey has revealed."

And "Brexit-supporting leave voters were more than twice as pro-empire than remainers."

Further, 39% of Leave voters vs 16% of Remain voters answered yes to "Would you like Britain to still have an empire?", while 40% of Leave voters vs. 66% of Remain voters answered "no", so in that sense you could well say it's not "beloved" by Brexiteers - given they to on the balance prefer no empire, but it's beloved by a significantly larger portion of Brexiteers.

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/11/uk-more-nostal...

Re:There Once Was an Empire by 082349872349872 on Thursday December 14, 2023 @01:13PM (#38644864)
Did you get what you wanted from Brexit?

(I had been under the impression that the choice on offer was between being a rather weighty part of the EU and, under the guise of "independence", playing Airstrip One to the US' Oceania, but perhaps I am mistaken?

China is playing Eastasia, of course. Not bad for 1949 speculation, even if it was based on 1920's-1930's nonfiction.

In a different fictional universe: "Always two there are")

Re:There Once Was an Empire by graemep on Saturday December 16, 2023 @10:45AM (#38665039)
Yes and no. It is too early to tell too - I see the big advantages of leaving to be long term, not in the first few years.

I certainly do not see the choice the way you do. My biggest objection to the EU is that it is centralising and trying to create a new country A risky exercise without common identity. A common currency that failed to be followed by fiscal central control was a huge mistake and lead to crisis in weaker economies (and the way Greece was treated, with de facto punishment imposed in return for bailout) was a disgrace. I will admit other multilateral organisations do similar (e.g. the domestic debt default unnecessarily imposed on Sri Lanka).

The UK has been playing airstrip one for a long time anyway. In someways we should be more like the French in terms of those policies.

In general, the way the EU is headed confirms my fears. Look at the last Dutch election, for example. There is a lot of bad legislation, a lot of lobbying by corporate interests - the government of the EU is far more removed from the people than national governments (which are bad enough) are.

Re:There Once Was an Empire by UncleSlacky on Thursday December 14, 2023 @06:41AM (#38640301)
Depending on how you define it, the Empire still exists (Britain still has colonies, even if they don't call them that). The return of Hong Kong to China is generally considered the "end of empire", though.

The sun will not set on it as long as it holds Pitcairn: https://what-if.xkcd.com/48/