Oil sector is lobbying for inefficient hydrogen cars to delay electrification

Re:Oil sector is lobbying for inefficient hydrogen cars to d... by tooltalk on Wednesday October 11, 2023 @07:27PM (#37851689)

According to Recurrent's recent report, most EVs lose only about 10% of SOH (or battery capacity/range) after 100,000 miles.

>> LFP batteries generally have about 3x the longevity of other lithium ion types <<

This is not true at all. All LFPs in EVs degrade much faster than other lithium ion batteries:

  Tesla LFP Battery 10% RANGE LOSS PROBLEM? | Model 3 RWD  (Cleanwatt citing Tessie's data) 
  The brand new LFP batteries will degrade substantially quicker.  There's not long-term retention data for LFP batteries on the market yet, but the trend tends to be substantially faster degradation.  Trends show them stabilizing around that 10% degradation mark in about half the time as non-LFP batteries - around 50,000 miles instead of 100,000 miles."

Even in ideal environment, such as ESS, LFPs would degrade substantially faster under high SOC/high c-rates.

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Re:Oil sector is lobbying for inefficient hydrogen cars to d... by elihu on Friday October 13, 2023 @03:08AM (#37867669)

LFPs lose some of their capacity early on, but then the degradation is much slower. It's just a weird quirk, it doesn't mean they're going to fail quickly.

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Re:Oil sector is lobbying for inefficient hydrogen cars to d... by tooltalk on Saturday October 14, 2023 @08:32PM (#37885644)

>> LFPs lose some of their capacity early on, but then the degradation is much slower. ... <<

There is nothing weird about lithium ion batteries, including LFPs, degrading quickly under high SOC/high C-rates -- ie, EVs. We don't know anything about LFP's longevity in EV profile -- ie, high SOC/high C-rates -- and while there is no long-term data to verify LFP's true lifespan in EVs, it's been demonstrated that LFP could lose as much as 1/3 of its lifespan under 100% SOC in ESS profile.

LFP's are already mostly limited to entry-level, low-range EVs due to its other technical short-coming in moving vehicles (ie, low energy density and weight). This quick degradation makes even less appealing in vehicles.

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