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Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by AlexandrB on Friday July 14, 2023 @08:36AM (#36723012)
Unfortunately there's already a backlash brewing against "15 minute cities"[1][2]. I wonder how much of this stuff is "organic" and how much is astroturf.

[1] https://rairfoundation.com/british-protest-15-minute-cities-...

[2] https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-edmonton-15-m...

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by padjo on Friday July 14, 2023 @08:39AM (#36723053)
I think that backlash is mostly from the “5g is globalist plot to control us” folks. Although given one of those people is running for the Democratic nomination maybe it’s not as safe to ignore them as I think…
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by Goronmon on Friday July 14, 2023 @08:43AM (#36723104)
I think that backlash is mostly from the “5g is globalist plot to control us” folks.

I've definitely seen it framed as a "left-wing" plot that the right/Republicans need to fight against. Same thing as the fight against LGBTQ+ rights, abortion rights, etc.

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by ZeroGravitas on Friday July 14, 2023 @08:48AM (#36723187)
It's sadly a mainstream right-wing talking point these days.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-02/how-did-t...

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by mwbajor on Friday July 14, 2023 @08:47AM (#36723164)
I live in one of the few 15 minute cities and I hate it. You might as well live in a jail or a zoo. Are you envious of the lions that live in their cages? They have everything they need close by! Water, companionship, food, etc....
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by AlexandrB on Friday July 14, 2023 @09:01AM (#36723355)
Can you elaborate on what's so bad about it? I lived in Toronto for a while and rarely had to drive because most things I needed were ~15 minutes away by subway/walking. It was awesome! It's not like someone is going to put an ankle monitor on you to prevent you from going further for stuff if you want to.
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by mwbajor on Friday July 14, 2023 @09:11AM (#36723471)
Can you elaborate on what you want me to elaborate on? I've been to Toronto, its another "sick town" and nothing I say is going to change your mind if you think living like an ant is "awesome!"
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by turnsout on Friday July 14, 2023 @10:13AM (#36724308)
I truly don't get this perspective. The value of living in a city is proximity to people and amenities. If you value something different, that's totally understandable, but why wouldn't you just move to the country?
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by mwbajor on Friday July 14, 2023 @10:47AM (#36724769)
Heh, they always say "You're free to leave any time you want".

When all we have is Maglev trains that go from one walkable city (e.g. jail) to another, how will you move to the country?

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by turnsout on Friday July 14, 2023 @11:42AM (#36725603)
Well, looking around I see nothing but freeways and cars, so I don't think we're in any danger of the utopia you describe
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by mwbajor on Friday July 14, 2023 @11:53AM (#36725758)
Yea yea, but you'd change it if you could and then say the same thing that every despot has always said since the beginning of time:

"You're free to leave if you want".

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by turnsout on Friday July 14, 2023 @12:11PM (#36725978)
I think you slightly overestimate my power as a hn commenter
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by AlexandrB on Friday July 14, 2023 @10:56AM (#36724899)
This is all very vague. "Sick town", "living like an ant". Can you actually explain what you mean by any of this?

I'll give you a specific example of why I think Toronto is good. Almost any night of the week I can catch a subway to a music venue - listen to some live music, drink a few beers, socialize a bit. Then I can get home without paying for a taxi or breaking the law by driving intoxicated. What's the equivalent weeknight activity in the suburbs? Sitting on my ass and watching TV all night? How is that less "sick" than what I described? This contrast is especially stark in Canadian winters when the weather and early sunsets make outdoor activities less desirable.

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by mwbajor on Friday July 14, 2023 @11:52AM (#36725738)
In every conversation I've had on this subject, urbanites discuss the "lack of nightlife" as a problem. My opinions are twofold on this:

A) If you need beer and nightlife to distract you from living in an urban dystopia, there is not much I can do. B) Most folks that want to leave the cities want space to do things with their families.

1) At night in my semi-suburban setting that I live in now, I work with my kids on things in my garage. Before we had kids, I did the same. My property allows me to spread out and have a woodshop, metalshop, lab, garden etc. 2) In the springtime/summertime tend to my garden (yes at night) so that I can eat natural foods without needing to share an "urban farm". Again, kids are included in this now. 3) Teach/play instruments without the restrictions of an apartment. 4) In the winter sure, if you want nightlife, there isnt much of that.

I don't drink and only listen to gaussian white noise so perhaps I'm not the right person to ask if you're looking for a "nightlife" centered activity/answer.

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by bipop5000 on Friday July 14, 2023 @10:43AM (#36724698)
Its not like you have to be confined within the 15 min city if you dont want to. You an always take the train or the bus to the 7-11 1 hour away to get your beer. Its just convenient to be in a place where you dont have to drive far away to get your basic amenities. Any East asian city should be a pretty good example.
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by Izkata on Friday July 14, 2023 @08:50AM (#36723214)
The backlash is real and is, at least partially, from how they're being implemented: Forceful restrictions instead of increased/local amenities.
Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by ryukafalz on Friday July 14, 2023 @09:01AM (#36723354)
In many cases restrictions and amenities are two sides of the same coin. You often can't add bike infrastructure in cities without taking away something from drivers (travel lanes, parking, etc) because drivers are already given nearly all the space on our streets. Drivers will complain that they're being restricted whenever you take anything away from them.

But people often can't get around safely on bikes without doing so; that bike infrastructure for those who would like to bike is a valuable amenity.

Re:Electric Vehicles for Everyone? The Impossible Dream by throwuwu on Friday July 14, 2023 @10:31AM (#36724545)
Here’s a milquetoast take that might be more palatable

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-03-02/the-downs...