Yeah I’m here for my job guaranteed by the state, and no way to get wealthy enough to escape the money printer that’s providing basic income.

You need hard money before you attempt this.

You only need a "money printer" if you don't have the chutzpah to tax wealthy people and the sources of wealth that the state supports.

Yes, nation states can totally resist infinite money if they just tax a fraction of the people in their tax base.

No one ever said anything about infinite money. The basic idea of socialism is that democracy should control some of the allocation of labor and that, because the functions of the nation state are necessary to the health of enterprises and because the fundamental purpose of society is the common good, the state has a right to some of the profits, which go beyond merely taking money from the wealthy.

Plenty of nation-states make different trade offs between productivity or growth or whatever and mitigating poverty. To act as if the particular style we have in America is the only possible thing that works is asinine.

No, democracy and socialism have nothing to do with printing money.

You can do either in a hard currency system.

No, as you can see by my posts, I'm a strong supporter of min wage, but there is no need for 'job guaranteed by the state' or 'UBI' - in fact, doing so would lead to economic collapse.

All of the UBI supporters need to do the math on it, it's 'extremely expensive'.

The 'economic collapse' part happens when 'not working' becomes normative, and socially acceptable - and be assured that it will.

The idea of 'working for a living' when you can just 'do whatever you want' is a bit glib. I suggest the only reason people would work, is to pay for that 'special thing' they want aka 'trip' or 'iphone'.

The ideological problem with UBI is the same as any broad social welfare program and that it doesn't reward material output. That is 'extremely bad'.

Finally - I do suggest that it may be possible to 'very simplistically means tested welfare' for people (to get rid of overhead) - and - to allow some of those people to have jobs so they don't get caught in that trap.

In fact, I suggest for people 65+ we'll need a program like this because they can still work, and frankly, working may be very good for their health, and they can do things that are 'extremely needed' right now, such as help to take care of the very elderly.