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Re:The Day Windows Died by chongli on Monday April 03, 2023 @06:26AM (#35421146)
Comparing Microsoft and Apple seems appropriate because they both develop operating systems that compete in the consumer market. It’s really not.

Apple is a hardware company that develops an operating system and services to add value to their hardware. They make nearly all of their money from hardware.

For the longest time, Microsoft didn’t really make any hardware at all, apart from some peripherals like keyboards and mice. Now they have Xbox and Surface, but they’re still predominantly a software and services company. The biggest reason they’re trashing up their OS with advertising and other crap these days is that they now make a lot less money from Windows licenses than they used to.

Long gone are the days when people lined up at the stores for their chance to snag a copy of Windows 95 on CD!

Re:The Day Windows Died by re-thc on Monday April 03, 2023 @07:43AM (#35421843)
> Long gone are the days when people lined up at the stores for their chance to snag a copy of Windows 95 on CD!

I preferred them served on floppy disks. 5 inches too!

Re:The Day Windows Died by cubefox on Monday April 03, 2023 @08:26AM (#35422351)
They now no longer make most their money from Windows, but from "Microsoft 365", a SAAS cloud version of Microsoft Office. Since they have no real competition in this area, they can basically do whatever they want. Littering Windows with ads, buying Activision, investing in OpenAI...
Re:The Day Windows Died by mostlysimilar on Monday April 03, 2023 @03:01PM (#35429512)
> Long gone are the days when people lined up at the stores for their chance to snag a copy of Windows 95 on CD!

Maybe if they made a better operating system that wouldn't be the case.

Re:The Day Windows Died by elihu on Monday April 03, 2023 @03:03PM (#35429543)
I think the main positive impact Microsoft had on the tech industry that they don't get enough credit for is that they allowed a competitive market for hardware to exist. (This was in part because IBM didn't insist that DOS be exclusive to IBM devices.) Hardware wasn't their business, so from their point of view, the more suppliers the better. We had fierce competition between manufacturers and they /mostly/ competed on a level playing field (with some notable exceptions that involved antitrust lawsuits). Eventually the hardware free-for-all created an environment where Linux could also flourish which has undermined Windows to an extent.

At this point Apple has a structural advantage over Microsoft in that Apple doesn't need to monetize their operating system to be profitable, as they're funded by hardware sales. That frees them up to provide a better user experience because they don't have to find way to make money off of their users. Not many companies are in a similar position, where they can recover software development expenses solely through hardware sales. There are a handful that could in theory, but they seem to lack the willingness.

Re:The Day Windows Died by reactorpres on Friday April 07, 2023 @08:29AM (#35480895)
Doesn’t Microsoft still make money from OEMs? Wouldn’t that be roughly the same as apple baking the os cost into the hardware?
Re:The Day Windows Died by yellowapple on Monday April 03, 2023 @03:31PM (#35429960)
> Apple is a hardware company that develops an operating system and services to add value to their hardware. They make nearly all of their money from hardware.

It seems like Apple has largely forgotten that; a hardware company seeking to maximize value for their hardware would, for example, tolerate (if not outright encourage) alternative operating systems on said hardware instead of using "security" as an excuse to maintain a tighter and tighter grip on a walled garden of software. The App Store is lucrative enough that it's sucked in the rest of Apple; instead of making hardware for hardware's sake, Apple's hardware is increasingly a funnel into that App Store ecosystem.

Likewise...

> The biggest reason they’re trashing up their OS with advertising and other crap these days is that they now make a lot less money from Windows licenses than they used to.

You'd think a company whose bread and butter is software and services would understand that pissing off customers ain't exactly a winning strategy for making money off those software and services.

I'd also question the idea that they're making significantly less money on Windows licenses than before. Yeah, not very many people are buying retail copies of Windows like they were back in the day, but there's still plenty of volume from desktop/laptop OEMs (in spite of the perennial claims that mobile devices have killed the desktop) and plenty of volume from enterprise customers (which is arguably Microsoft's money tree, far more so than anything consumer-facing). Microsoft's probably perfectly fine with Windows Home Edition (and even, to an extent, Professional Edition) being a loss leader of sorts if it means maintaining mindshare such that enterprises instinctively pick Windows Enterprise Edition and Windows Server for their business needs, and especially if they instinctively pick those running on Azure. Shoving a bunch of ads and bloatware into their flagship OS is entirely unnecessary from that perspective.

The ads and bloatware are more likely from the other side of Microsoft's strategy: competing with Google on the ad delivery and search engine front. There's growing pressure from the Bing side of things to use the consumer versions of Windows as a funnel into Bing - as manifested in everything from the Start Menu to the incessant demands to use Edge as the default browser (which just so happens to use Bing as its default search engine).

There are countless other examples of this tendency of accidental goldmines sucking in the rest of a company's products and turning them into funnels. Valve is a notable case, with Steam evolving from a tool to support Valve's bread-and-butter of PC games to Valve's bread-and-butter in and of itself - and with Valve's software and (more recently) hardware projects serving primarily as funnels into the Steam ecosystem.

Re:The Day Windows Died by chongli on Monday April 03, 2023 @04:02PM (#35430422)
You'd think a company whose bread and butter is software and services would understand that pissing off customers ain't exactly a winning strategy for making money off those software and services.

It’s a terminal phase you see in a lot of companies. Phase 1 is mega growth in user base. Phase 2 is innovation to try to sell as much as possible to the base, but mostly steady state. Phase 3 is shady monetizing and dark patterns to try to squeeze the last drops of revenue out of the base before dying.

It resembles the lifecycle of a star actually.