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A comment on Cars kill cities. Parent comment

Re:Cars kill cities by InclinedPlane on Thursday January 26, 2012 @03:10PM (#3515750)
You have extrapolated data from this article that is not actually in existence.

Here, let's look at the actual budget for Texas: http://www.lbb.state.tx.us/Other_Pubs/Overview_Highway_Fund_...

Texas levies a 20 cent per gallon tax on gas and diesel, while the federal government levies an 18.4 cent tax for gas and 24.4 cents for diesel.

Over 2 years (the budget period for the state) the gas tax provided $4.55 billion for roadwork. However, 1/4 of the state gas tax revenue is diverted to education so the actual revenue is around $6.1 billion. Additionally, $6.9 billion of funding is provided from federal sources. This is roughly equivalent to the amount raised by the federal gas tax but also pays for things like airports. A further $2.7 billion is raised through registration fees, and other motor vehicle related taxes and fees.

In total the gas and motor vehicle related taxes pay for the entirety of the TxDOT budget plus they help subsidize the local school system to the tune of 3/4 of a billion per year.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Cars kill cities by natrius on Thursday January 26, 2012 @03:56PM (#3515958)
I think you're correct that I misused the numbers. My point that roads don't pay for themselves is still correct.

"In Texas, [Mike Krusee, former chairman of the Texas House of Representatives Transportation Committee] said that, on average, it cost the state 20-30 cents per person per mile to build and maintain a road to the suburbs, yet drivers only pay on average 2-3 cents per mile through the gas tax, vehicles fees, etc.

"What we found was that no road that we built in Texas paid for itself," said Krusee. "None."

http://www.austincontrarian.com/austincontrarian/2009/11/aga...

Gas taxes and other highway user fees pay less today than ever before.

http://reason.com/archives/2011/06/17/the-facts-about-transp...

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Cars kill cities by InclinedPlane on Thursday January 26, 2012 @07:30PM (#3516673)
This doesn't say that car users are not paying for the roads they use. Indeed, the figures I pointed out already proved they do pay, and more. What this is saying is quite different. It's saying that some roads are more expensive per passenger-mile than others, and the most recently built roads in Texas are being subsidized by other roads. He's making the argument that people driving (and thus using gas, and thus paying the gas tax) on poorly maintained roads in the city center are subsidizing the construction of less trafficked roads in the suburbs.

It's questionable to me whether this is even a valid complaint. Road upkeep and maintenance is not always linearly proportional to gasoline consumption. Cars and trucks will idle more in the city than in the suburbs and thus increase gas use, but that's no excuse to demand a higher proportion of funds be used for those roads.

Besides which, at best this is a problem of car use subsidizing other car use, not of non-car tax revenues being misspent to subsidize road building.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Cars kill cities by natrius on Friday January 27, 2012 @03:07PM (#3519919)
It's questionable to me whether this is even a valid complaint. [...] that's no excuse to demand a higher proportion of funds be used for those roads.

It is a valid complaint. It's not about demanding that the funds be used for those roads; it's about the people who use roads being the ones who pay for them. That isn't currently the case.

Besides which, at best this is a problem of car use subsidizing other car use, not of non-car tax revenues being misspent to subsidize road building.

Since the gas tax is insufficient to meet Texas's road needs, cities and counties have been funding them from their general funds; that is, via property and sales taxes. They are only partially reimbursed by the state.

http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/aust...

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Re:Cars kill cities by barrkel on Thursday January 26, 2012 @11:31PM (#3517155)
It doesn't sound like you're taking into account the opportunity cost of the land set aside for roads. That's valuable space that could be used for other things.
[ Parent | on HN ]