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Re:Chief scientist of major corporation can’t handle critici... by dekhn on Wednesday November 23, 2022 @11:54AM (#33721645)
If there was a reason for people to be higher statistical risk based on birth month (say, "babies born in november had 0.5% higher risk of long-term respiratory disease") then, yes, that should be incorporated into a model.

Genetic risk of cancer cannot be included in insurance decisions (excluding voluntary life insurance) because a law was passed (GINA) preventing it.

It's not the role of the loan industry to make it easier for black people who appear to be a higher statistical risk to get loans. That's the purpose of government- to make it illegal to include genetic history in life insurance models- provided that society believes in that principle.

Re:Chief scientist of major corporation can’t handle critici... by jrmg on Wednesday November 23, 2022 @12:11PM (#33721810)
It's not the role of the loan industry to make it easier for black people who appear to be a higher statistical risk to get loans. That's the purpose of government- to make it illegal to include genetic history in life insurance models- provided that society believes in that principle.

Another way to say that - one that appears less uncaring to readers - would be “yes, including birth month or race in insurance risk calculations would be unfair+, so it should not be done. If necessary, the government should step in to prevent this”.

+ you may squabble with the use of ‘unfair’ here - obviously it is not ‘unfair’ in the stastical sense, but that’s not what the word generally means in spoken English. ‘Inequitable’ would be better, but for some reason ‘equity’ seems to be evolving to mean ‘at all costs, produces equality of outcome’ and so is a victim to the same problem in the opposite direction. I chose the more common word.

[edit: I used insurance here, sorry - the same would apply to loans I think]

Re:Chief scientist of major corporation can’t handle critici... by jrmg on Wednesday November 23, 2022 @01:01PM (#33722453)
I’ve been thinking about this more, and it’s occurred to me that there is an underlying assumption in It’s not he purpose of the loan industry… that corporations are required to make decisions amorally - which is don’t think is or should be the case. That may be an underlying schism in our argument.
Re:Chief scientist of major corporation can’t handle critici... by dekhn on Wednesday November 23, 2022 @01:41PM (#33722975)
You are correct. I expect that corporations understand they exist in a competitive environment and incorporating morality represents a real risk that your competitor will replace you, because morality is not profitable.

I do agree that if you expect corporations to act morally, then it would be sensible for them to be more careful in understanding and correcting long-term social ills.

Re:Chief scientist of major corporation can’t handle critici... by mcguire on Wednesday November 23, 2022 @03:08PM (#33723909)
Is it the role of the loan industry to make it more difficult for black people to get loans, regardless of whether the individual is a higher statistical risk? (Apparently so, since that's the way it's always worked, right?)

It is trivial to bake an irrelevant distinction into a naive ML driven process.