Yes, it can cause all sorts of havoc. But my point was that it generally only causes that havoc, when improperly handled. This doesn't mean I don't have any empathy for those people however. I just want to make sure people understand that just like anything else in life; misuse = malaise and debilitative disease, etc.

For instance: Sulphuric acid. Dangerous stuff if handled wrong. Potentially deadly.

But, when you wear the proper protective gear, and are careful with it; it's "safe" to handle.

I used to have to handle the stuff. There was no issues with me handling the stuff, when I was in charge of the safety equipment. The moment they had someone else take over the night time position and swapped me to mornings due to internal politics at work; the safety went down. Why?

Because the guy in charge of the safety equipment being properly maintained at night to ensure the morning person didn't arrive to unusable equipment without a full cleaning, etc; wasn't doing his job.

This led to a new person dropping acid all over the floor, that had to be neutralized and cleaned up. A giant safety hazard. Somehow, I got the blame. Why?

Because the new person who took over that work, said I didn't tell him to do this.

A bold faced lie. I was the one who got my supervisor out of that position, because he would do dumb stuff like handled it bare handed, and say "It's just fine".

But again, internal politics prevailed. People wanted to be lazy, and stupid, with a dangerous substance. They didn't like being held accountable or responsible for their actions and the consequences that come with it. So I was pushed out of the company, citing "cultural issues".

Now, back to asbestos.

It's the same, damn, thing. If handled correctly, it is generally safe. (Safe as in it's not going to do anything, cause no one is messing with it.)

But construction workers are generally not being safe in almost any job. The few who are, are the ones who tell me the kinds of horror stories they come across, because of employing stupid people.

And home renovations aren't exactly performed by geniuses either. People start tearing apart walls and ceilings, thinking "oh this is fun, everything is fine".

And then they develop cancer, because they didn't bother to wear the proper safety gear to do something like that. And no, those stupid f'n white mask things are not the proper mask. You need something more along the lines of a P100 mask to do the job right. But who knows to do that, right? Not many people, since they think any ol mask will do.

Just like how construction workers wearing a bandana over their face think its just fine.

Just like how my old supervisor would handle the acid without gloves, cause he never got burnt so it "must be fine".

So I apologize if I come off as brash and rude, but I do not like how we placate and accommodate stupidity in society. And asbestos... while very dangerous if not handled correctly; is also a perfect example as to why many people should NOT be doing the things they are doing to stay safe.

Without looking at any studies, I almost guarantee you that almost all those people who developed cancer or mesothelioma in Australia, Canada, America, and otherwise, when it comes to home renovations only; did it improperly.

It's not like we didn't know it was bad for people to do it wrong.

What we didn't know was just how many people would do it wrong.

And yes, there are 'safe products' out there. But then again, they also aren't 'safe'.

How so?

Toxicity once flammable. None of these replacements are actually 'fire proof'. Not anywhere near like how asbestos is. They are fire resistant at best. And what's worse is that many of the things we fill our homes with to replace many of these old materials... end up being more deadly in some ways.

How so?

Take a look at this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87hAnxuh1g8

This is just one such video that shows a point I am trying to make here.

Many of these materials we have replaced in our homes, were better at keeping us safe from the dangers of sudden fire and smoke. In a 'synthetic' home, your chances of survival are extremely low in these kinds of scenarios.

This is part of why house fire deaths have risen, at least according to my knowledge.

Here is a chart that pertains to Canada, in regards to unintentional deaths; like smoke inhalation: https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220616/cg-b0...

it comes from this page: https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220616/dq220...

It's part of why having a working smoke alarm on every floor of the house, along with carbon monoxide detectors is so damn important now.

Problem with this whole thing though, is that there is so much debate that goes on around what causes these fires, that people forget to look at what is being burnt when it goes up in flame. So they look at the fire, and not the smoke.

What I have been told and have read from firefighters is that often the people they go in to save, are already dead from smoke inhalation. Hence why I focus on it.

And guess what would have saved them...

Older style materials, that contain things, like asbestos. Ironically enough.

You just can't win. You either use the 'safer' synthetics and risk smoke inhalation, which can cause cancer too... or your risk 'dangerous' asbestos and other such things, but they can cause cancer too...

Personally, I'm not really sure where I stand on this, since no one wants cancer obviously. But I personally don't mind having things like asbestos in things I won't ever be touching, or breathing around. I also don't mind having synthetics in areas where fire is least likely. (Like the bathroom perhaps, where a fire sprinkler wouldn't be a terrible idea.)

But again, this all goes back to my issue with society being over all kind of dumb.

And I think we need to stop serving the stupid. It's costly on society to keep them safe and in some cases, alive. It's not a favorable opinion for many, but that's kind of a them problem, and not a me problem at that point.

It's the same with healthcare and people who expect free healthcare while doing everything they can to ruin their body. It shouldn't be allowed. But then, we also shouldn't be stomping on peoples freedom to do what they wish with their own body.

But I am a believer in proper consequence for actions taken. Hence my position on this matter.

If scientists and such can find a way to make asbestos safe or safer, I'm all for it. Because it means less people will die from accidental fires that were not anyone's particular fault. It also means less need to make these synthetics which are often petroleum based in some way, or some other toxic chemical that when heated off gasses nasty byproducts that kill the inhabitants. That's before we mention the environmental effect of even making them in the first place.

See what I mean when I say we just can't win on this?

We're damned if we do, damned if we don't.

So I'd rather we use what we know works, in the places we know it can work safely. For homes, maybe asbestos isn't the best option. But the alternatives are often not much better in their own ways, which is my main point on that matter. So... what to do?

Make something better?

Sure, let's get on that. But until then, what to do?

I'll leave that there.

Again, I have empathy for those who are harmed by asbestos; but mostly only for those who weren't doing dumb things and got harmed by it anyways. The rest who were being dumb... I have a lot less empathy for.

I think I'm done with this site.

I make plenty of comments knowing people will downvote them based on content and still ended up so much positive karma it would take serious effort to burn it all.

So, sorry, but while I didn't downvote you, I do disagree with you; entirely. Validly.

https://github.com/minimaxir/hacker-news-undocumented/issues...

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> TL;DR: apparently this can happen due to an account being "rate-limited". Rate-limited accounts can post a max of five posts within 24 hours.

See : https://hn.nuxtjs.org/item/15507821

Specifically this bit:

dang 1018 days ago

That's a sign that your account is rate-limited. We rate limit accounts when they repeatedly get involved in flamewars or regularly break the site guidelines or post lots of low-quality (for HN) comments. It's a crude tool but one of the few we have to prevent such things from overrunning the site.

The thread also has interesting discussions on other mod tools: shadowbanning, IP bans, and the like.

Apparently the way to un-rate-limit an account is to send in an email and mention that you will "stick to civil, substantive comments that scrupulously follow" https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. Some amount of convincing prostration may be required, as a sort of high-level turing test. There does not seem to be a way to do this while not giving away your email address (which was not required at signup).

The moderator mentioned something about repeated, human-written warnings before rate-limiting, but this does not seem to be the case now (2020) - rate limiting seems to be a milder, less-known variant of the shadowban.

________________

Downvoting, flagging, and moderator actions are three different things.

Posting something people disagree with isn’t the same as a flame war. Keeping things civil is a requirement, which trips people up.

Prior to that, I wasn't rate limited. After that, I was. Make of it what you will.

I'll still use it to see what people think, but that's about all its good for in the comments section now; just like Reddit, Twitter, and others.

But at least the links are still interesting.

P.S. I'm mostly only commenting still right now because

A: I haven't made my decision yet and

B: It would be rude to ignore those who did reply to me kindly.