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Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by midoridensha on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @05:15AM (#32748351)
>Meanwhile, switch automobiles from ICE to EVs.

Better yet, redesign cities so they're walkable and bikable and have good public transit (running on electricity of course), so people don't need cars. Cars are bad in many many ways: emissions are only a small part of the problem with cars. Crashes kill tens of thousands of people in America alone every year, they cause people to be obese because they don't walk anywhere, I could go on and on.

>And replace natural gas heating for homes with electric heat pumps.

Electric heat pumps actually don't work in very cold weather.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by matthiasl on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @07:46AM (#32749356)
> Electric heat pumps actually don't work in very cold weather.

I think that statement needs to be qualified and quantified.

Qualified: your claim is probably only intended to apply to air-source heat pumps, not ground-source heat pumps. Ground-source heat pumps are popular in places with cold weather, for instance Sweden.

Quantified: If you mean -40°C, then, yes, air-source heat pumps aren't going to work. But most people don't live in places that cold, and just because we can't use air-source heat pumps in a few places doesn't mean they're useless everywhere. Here's a data sheet for a relatively cheap air-source heat pump that's rated to work down to -25°C (about -14 F):

https://img.polarpumpen.se/pfiles/fujitsu-km-slim-09-12-14-p...

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by nightski on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @01:12PM (#32753335)
They aren't readily available in the U.S. and even if you could buy it online or something no local place tends to service them. This is a generalization, so I am sure there are exceptions but it seems to be the case in most places I've seen.

As far as ground sourced those are significantly more expensive. The cost/benefit is not there unless the only factor in your purchase is climate change.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by midoridensha on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @08:37PM (#32759449)
Yeah, this is what I was referring to. The heat pumps available in the US only seem to work down to freezing (0C). After that, they just turn on resistive heating, which is very inefficient.
Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by criddell on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @07:45AM (#32749339)
> redesign cities so they're walkable and bikable and have good public transit (running on electricity of course), so people don't need cars

I think you underestimate how much people like their cars and aren't considering how unwilling people are to walk or bike when it's cold or hot out.

Public transit should be fixed though. Keep buses and their fixed route and schedule during rush hours and for the rest of the day have publicly funded ride-share type of service.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by doubled112 on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @08:11AM (#32749555)
One way, the nearest plaza to me is a 7 minute drive. There's nothing closer than this plaza.

The route Google Maps suggests walking is 44 minutes. There are no sidewalks. There are two roundabouts, one mini, where drivers aren't even really sure whose turn it is.

It isn't a relaxing experience by any stretch of the imagination, especially if I wanted to bring my kids.

It's not that I'm unwilling. I want to walk more. I just don't have 1h30m to dedicate to the most basic of trips.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by ryukafalz on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @11:22AM (#32751846)
Yeah, this is why we need to redesign our streets. Even distances that are easily bikeable are currently made effectively impassable for most people outside of a car, and there’s no reason it should be that way.

If it’s a 44 minute walk I’d guesstimate that’d be 20 minutes at a leisurely pace on a bike, or 15 if you’re quick on a road bike (or still leisurely on an e-bike).

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by dieselgate on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @09:49AM (#32750602)
I feel you in regards to transporting your kids - or anything else for that matter. Walking and public transit is great but what about buying groceries or anything even slightly more to carry? It seems to me people often overlook the "payload capacity" needed for transit, we're not all just commuting to work all the time.
Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by scrose on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @10:21AM (#32751001)
A car is overkill for carrying most things day-to-day if you don’t live in an area built solely around cars.

Walk to any Costco in NYC and you’ll see plenty of people doing just fine with 50+lbs of groceries and a shopping cart.

Alternatively, go to any suburban grocery store and you’ll see people driving away in massive pickup trucks and SUVs having only picked up a gallon of milk.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by criddell on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @11:10AM (#32751679)
> A car is overkill for carrying most things day-to-day if you don’t live in an area built solely around cars.

> you’ll see people driving away in massive pickup trucks and SUVs having only picked up a gallon of milk

It's not about need. Most of those people didn't choose the massive truck or SUV because that was the most sensible vehicle for them. They bought it because they like it.

Even if they don't strictly need to drive their truck to the store, they still will because they like driving it. It's not a wildly different mindset from people who buy the latest and greatest phone every year or spend thousands on a wristwatch that keeps time worse than a $20 digital watch you buy in a drug store.

I've lived in cities and depended on public transportation when I was younger and now I'm out in the 'burbs. Right now, the suburbs is where I want to be. My quality of life is higher. If I had a self-driving car, I'd move even further out of the city.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by scrose on Thursday September 08, 2022 @12:03AM (#32761056)
I’m not sure why you only partially quoted me and then restated what I had been replying to

Do some people drive because they like it? Yes

Do some people drive because it’s required to do anything based off of a car-centric environment? Yes

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by ryukafalz on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @11:36AM (#32752040)
I can answer this question as someone currently living in a pretty walkable city. Most of the time I just stop by the grocery store on my way to or from somewhere else and pick up a few things. City grocery stores tend to have pretty short lines because a lot of other people are doing the same, so you don’t have to wait for 5 people to empty a full cart in front of you. (The exception being Whole Foods somehow, I think the fact that it has a giant parking garage catering to drivers has something to do with it.)

If I do need to make a larger trip, I bring a folding wagon. It’s less convenient than just stopping by on my way home from something else but there are two full grocery stores within a 5 minute walk of home so it’s no big deal. Same as before, minimal lines.

I’m about to move to the suburbs where the nearest large grocery store will be a 7-minute bike away, so I’m planning to get a front-loader cargo bike like the Urban Arrow: https://na.urbanarrow.com/family-bikes/

…though while it is that short of a trip taking a direct route, that route seems somewhat inhospitable outside of a car, so in practice I might have to take some long detours. The town’s supposedly planning to put in bicycle infrastructure at some point, but I think that’ll be my rallying cry once I move there. :)

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by criddell on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @09:46AM (#32750562)
If nobody asks, a sidewalk will never be installed. It might be worth figuring out how to ask your city to install a sidewalk. In the city of Austin, a lot of the work is driven by ADA compliance.
Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by doubled112 on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @11:46AM (#32752178)
They put in about 2km of parking stones with reflective indicators - the flexible kind. Couldn't even be bothered to add a curb.

Took them a year to do it, too.

I guess it's better than a painted line.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by slothtrop on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @10:31AM (#32751127)
The number of cars in very walkable cities (e.g. Tokyo) is underestimated also, but the fact remains that if the infrastructure is there people will use it. It's convenient. As it stands, being without a car is not very convenient in many places in N.A.
Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by midoridensha on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @08:40PM (#32759471)
People liking their cars is why we're going to have a climate catastrophe.

And public transit is not feasible as long as cities are designed for cars. Train lines just don't scale when things are too spread out. Public transit only works when lots of people are going between the same two points. Public ride-share? You mean taxis? That's not feasible at all; we can't afford to give everyone a private chauffeur.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by Xylakant on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @07:16AM (#32749102)
Depends on what you define as “very cold”. Comparatively few people live in climates where you consistently have extended periods where the average temperature drops below zero. And there are ways to work with that. For example what’s in German called “Eisspeicherheizung” (ice storage heating). It cleverly uses the crystalization energy of water [1]. You basically bury a few tons of water and use it as a buffer. You drive a heat pump that extracts energy from the water and on the other side, you run a collector circuit that collects solar energy and heat from the air.

Effectively, every time the temperature raises above 0 degrees, you fill up your buffer.

The size of the buffer is designed so that at the end of the heating period, most water has been turned to ice. And now you also have free cooling for the summer.

This system can cover periods where the outside temperature drops below zero without loss of efficiency.

[1] freezing a liter of water at 0 degrees requires an equivalent energy to heating a liter by 80 degrees Celsius.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by stinos on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @07:19AM (#32749128)
Electric heat pumps actually don't work in very cold weather.

Sure they do, their efficiency just drops to below the point where it remains feasible (i.e. cheaper than furnace/boiler). Technology has come a long way and most of the world's population doen't seem to live in that 'very cold' weather, so I'd wager heat pumps are still the way to go. Especially ground source heat pumps thrive well enough in cold climates, just not always doable to install on existing sites.

https://carbonswitch.com/do-heat-pumps-work-in-cold-weather/ touches the subject; not the best source perhaps but searching for 'cold climate heat pump' gives plenty of info.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by cycomanic on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @11:16AM (#32751758)
> Electric heat pumps actually don't work in very cold weather.

You can use heat pumps with a underground heat sink (not sure what they are called in english). However, they really only make sense in climates where it is extensively below -10 degree Celcius. Even in southern Sweden they don't really make much sense.

Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by mmaurizi on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @07:14AM (#32749088)
How cold is "very cold" to you? There are air-source heat pumps that work all the way down to -15F now.
Re:Building future cities out of timber could save 100B tons... by AstralStorm on Wednesday September 07, 2022 @09:11AM (#32750083)
The problem with heat will solve itself, because the amount of GHG we pumped out already will heat everything up sufficiently, or more than that.

As for cars, for mass transport nothing beats ships or rail. The last mile, however, remains to be trucks for the forseeable future.