We need to consider ways to reverse or at least slow rapid depopulation

Re:We need to consider ways to reverse or at least slow rapi... by bityard on Monday August 22, 2022 @12:53PM (#32554044)

A fascinating article that teeter-totters between wild speculation about the condition of human society many decades in the future (which we are demonstrably bad at predicting) and tenuous cause-and-effect relationships. But there are also a lot of very interesting current statistics that I was not previously aware of.

When I was young, absolutely everyone studying the numbers was certain that overpopulation would result in the collapse of civilization at some point. Maybe sooner, maybe later, but always eventually. Now that population growth is slowing (and it's not at all certain yet that it WILL stop or reverse, just that the recent trend is toward that direction), the sentiment is that de-population is inevitable and will ALSO lead to a collapse in society.

Maybe this is a crazy idea, but what if human populations could reach a steady state? The Earth is a finite resource[1] and can only sustain so many of us. I don't have the foggiest idea how to structure or enforce such a thing but it seems like the most realistic goal.

(1. It should go without saying that off-planet human colonies are at best science fiction, and will be within our lifetimes.)

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Re:We need to consider ways to reverse or at least slow rapi... by rekabis on Monday August 22, 2022 @01:01PM (#32554156)

“Steady state” is impossible because of one thing, and one thing only: Capitalism.

It’s a system less than four centuries old, but absolutely requires growth at any cost: growth of the population, growth of resource extraction, growth of products produced, growth of profits. It demands infinite growth on a finite planet.

Until we move away from capitalism, any form of steady state or even degrowth will be impossible.

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Re:We need to consider ways to reverse or at least slow rapi... by bityard on Monday August 22, 2022 @03:51PM (#32556321)

I was wondering how long it would take for an anti-capitalist rant to show up. :/

Anyway, capitalism does not require the extraction of natural resources. That is a problem related to building a modern civilization. There is NO WAY to have the kind of technology (and therefore quality of life) we have today without digging things out of the ground to either burn for energy or manufacture into tools or products. We're making progress on solving parts of this (e.g. renewable energy sources, recycling) but it's fundamentally intractable and orthogonal to any economic system.

If what you say is really true, then capitalism should spiral into non-existence and cease to exist whenever there is an economic downturn or decline in productivity. As it happens, we have those roughly once a decade and times get tough for some people but civilization doesn't end and eventually we pull out of it. Ergo, either world trade is not dominated by a capitalist economy, or your definition of capitalism doesn't align with reality.

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