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Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by hnlmorg on Monday August 01, 2022 @09:00AM (#32305338)
I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this. Partly because this is really more of an opinion-based discussion but also because comparing Singapore to the US or Europe is never going to work given how massively different their cultures are. So there's far more variables at play than just how the markets are run.

That all said, one part did stick out for me:

> Your argument would apply equally well to jobs: people need a job just as much as they need housing. Yet, employers with great reputation still find it easier to attract good applicants than those with lousy reputations.

I'd argue that disproves your point rather than proves it. The reason being, lousy jobs still exist because employers know that people need jobs. So there's no incentive for employers to change. Hence why we need employment laws.

Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by eru on Monday August 01, 2022 @09:11AM (#32305437)
Your argument would prove that almost all jobs are lousy and only provide the legal minimum required for pay, safety, etc.

In Singapore our legal minimum wage is 0. However good luck finding anyone working for 0 dollars.

I would suggest checking why jobs exceed the legal minimum, and how we can ensure more people can have better jobs.

(My view is perfectly compatible with there being some crappy jobs, and some people even taking those crappy jobs.)

Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by hnlmorg on Monday August 01, 2022 @09:24AM (#32305597)
This comes back to my point about different cultures. For example some American and UK companies have been gaming the system, arguing that people who work from them are not employees. In the UK we call them gig workers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gig_worker) and they're effectively working for 0 "dollars" if business is slow that day. Yet some people work them simply because they have no other choice.
Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by eru on Monday August 01, 2022 @10:34PM (#32314560)
In Singapore, we just have employment laws that aren't as strenuous on the employer, so there's less need to 'game the system'.

Oversimplified: legally everyone is already a gig worker in Singapore.

Seems to work out fairly well.

This is also closer to how the system worked in eg the US until a few decades ago, when it was easier to get a job just by walking into the shop and asking and also work your way through college etc.

I remember, Slatestarcodex had an article about the dangers of outsourcing your social welfare to employers.

Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by hnlmorg on Tuesday August 02, 2022 @04:31AM (#32316349)
I feel this point is getting lost on you but Singapore has a vastly different culture to America. The fact that Singapore doesn't need to "game the system" isn't because there are fewer regulations. It's because it's a different culture.

The reason America needs legislation is because American companies have a culture of abusing a free market.

What works for one country doesn't automatically work for another.

Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by eru on Tuesday August 02, 2022 @10:16PM (#32326867)
Singapore is mostly made up of immigrants from China. Remember, China is the place where we like to complain about 'companies abusing a free market' even more than in the US.
Re:A looming copper crunch and why recycling can’t fix it by hnlmorg on Wednesday August 03, 2022 @06:18AM (#32329798)
I've been to Singapore. I know exactly what it's like. I stand by my point.